Jan. 1, 2026

The Sleepy Lagoon Murder Part Two

The Sleepy Lagoon Murder Part Two
Spotify podcast player badge
Apple Podcasts podcast player badge
RSS Feed podcast player badge
Amazon Music podcast player badge
Audible podcast player badge
PlayerFM podcast player badge
Podcast Addict podcast player badge
PocketCasts podcast player badge
Spotify podcast player icon Apple Podcasts podcast player icon RSS Feed podcast player icon Amazon Music podcast player icon Audible podcast player icon PlayerFM podcast player icon Podcast Addict podcast player icon PocketCasts podcast player icon

José Gallardo Díaz, a young Mexican man found barely breathing near Sleepy Lagoon, a reservoir in commerce, CA, on August 2, 1942. The case became a flashpoint for racial tension and injustice in Los Angeles. Without this case and the trial that followed, the infamous Zoot Suit trial may not have happened. In this episode, Cristina tells Carmen the unjust trial that led to people v zamora.

If you have topic suggestions, feel free to email Historiasunknownpodcast@gmail.com or use the contact us form on the website https://www.historiasunknown.com/contact/

Want ad free episodes? And weekly bonus episodes? Support Historias Unknown on Patreon https://www.patreon.com/HistoriasUnknownPodcast

By joining, you can help Historias Unknown donate 20% funds to charity. This month's donation went to CLEAN, carwash worker center, an org that has been helping car wash workers who are unable to leave their homes due to increasing ICE raids in LA county, by providing groceries to over 200 car wash workers. Follow @carwasherxs on instagram

Follow on social media:

Instagram: https : //www.instagram.com/historiasunknown/

Threads: https://www.threads.net/@historiasunknown

Sources

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleepy_Lagoon_murder
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bell,_California
https://www.history.com/articles/zoot-suit-riots
https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/features/zoot-jose-gallardo-diaz/
https://guides.loc.gov/latinx-civil-rights/people-v-zamorra
Murder at the Sleepy Lagoon: Zoot Suits, Race and Riot in Wartime LA by Eduardo Obregon Pagan
The Woman in the Zoot Suit by Catherine S. Ramirez
The Zoot-Suit Riots: The Psychology of Symbolic Annihilation by Mauricio Mazo

Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/historias-unknown--6253658/support.

WEBVTT

1
00:00:11.400 --> 00:00:14.880
Hi everyone. This is Carmen and Christina and this is

2
00:00:15.039 --> 00:00:18.440
Estoria's Unknown, a podcast where we talk about Latin American history.

3
00:00:18.559 --> 00:00:22.640
Sometimes it's horrible and deals with heavy topics like racism, corruption,

4
00:00:23.120 --> 00:00:26.440
and genocide. But more than that, it's also by resistance,

5
00:00:26.519 --> 00:00:31.320
power and community. And today we are continuing our Sleepy

6
00:00:31.440 --> 00:00:36.280
Lagoon topic with part two. We had a little accidental break,

7
00:00:36.320 --> 00:00:40.399
their unplanned break. I should say, yeah, you were saying, yes,

8
00:00:40.479 --> 00:00:43.200
but we're back. We're back, baby, just in time for

9
00:00:43.200 --> 00:00:45.399
the end of the year. Well, this will come out

10
00:00:45.439 --> 00:00:47.960
in twenty three six, already want it? No this Thursday?

11
00:00:48.159 --> 00:00:53.960
Thursday is the first full Oh shit, yeah, okay, new year,

12
00:00:54.119 --> 00:00:57.719
New Year and new us. Yeah all right, wow, I

13
00:00:58.159 --> 00:01:00.719
am truly shocked. Okay, yes, this will come out in

14
00:01:00.719 --> 00:01:04.519
the new year. All right. So last episode we discussed

15
00:01:04.519 --> 00:01:08.159
the Sleepy Lagoon murder, leading up to Josselijas's tragic death

16
00:01:08.239 --> 00:01:11.840
and ending with the roundup of Mexican and Mexican American

17
00:01:11.879 --> 00:01:14.920
youth in response to the murder. And today we're gonna

18
00:01:14.959 --> 00:01:19.239
go over the trial, the movement to free the defendants

19
00:01:19.280 --> 00:01:23.840
and people versus Samora. So there were twenty two defendants,

20
00:01:23.879 --> 00:01:27.159
all raging from fourteen to twenty two years old, and

21
00:01:27.200 --> 00:01:32.040
the key defendants were Jack Melendez, Victor Thompson, aher Padilla,

22
00:01:32.319 --> 00:01:39.239
John Matthus, Ismael Parra, Victor Sewobia, Henry Levas, Gus Samora,

23
00:01:40.239 --> 00:01:47.239
Manuel Reguz, Robert Dejuz, Manuel Delgado, Jose Ruiz, ak Chepe,

24
00:01:47.879 --> 00:01:55.200
Benny Alvarez, Edward Grandpre, Joe Errera, Gualalupe aka Lupe Orosco,

25
00:01:55.879 --> 00:02:03.040
Danny Verdugo, Joe Carpio, Eugene Carpio, and Henry Inostrosa. And

26
00:02:03.159 --> 00:02:06.120
like I said last episode, there were also Mexican girls

27
00:02:06.359 --> 00:02:09.039
slash young women who were brought in for questioning during

28
00:02:09.080 --> 00:02:11.879
the investigation, and although they weren't found guilty in the

29
00:02:11.919 --> 00:02:16.479
sense of having been officially indicted, charged, gone through trial

30
00:02:16.560 --> 00:02:19.199
through the normal criminal justice system, they were thought of

31
00:02:19.199 --> 00:02:24.680
as guilty. These girls slash young women were Frances Silva, Josefina,

32
00:02:24.879 --> 00:02:31.199
Josephine Gonzalez, Juanita Jenny Gonzalez, Dora Bacca Barrios, and Lorena Encinas,

33
00:02:31.680 --> 00:02:34.080
and they were all sent to the Ventura School for

34
00:02:34.159 --> 00:02:38.719
Girls on the grounds of having consorted with bad company.

35
00:02:39.319 --> 00:02:41.439
So like they didn't go through you know, the normal

36
00:02:41.479 --> 00:02:43.479
criminal justice system, they just were sent to the school

37
00:02:43.520 --> 00:02:46.319
for girls. And we've talked about these school for girls. Yeah,

38
00:02:46.520 --> 00:02:51.360
back in the eugenics episode, yes, for sterilization episode, which

39
00:02:51.479 --> 00:02:54.879
is tied in well, it was about eugenics, yes exactly.

40
00:02:55.000 --> 00:02:56.960
So that type of school was where they were sent

41
00:02:57.000 --> 00:03:01.199
to and these were like run like military, basic type situation.

42
00:03:01.560 --> 00:03:04.199
It was a rough place to be in and many

43
00:03:04.280 --> 00:03:06.680
of them remained wards of the state even after the

44
00:03:06.719 --> 00:03:09.159
men had won their appeal and were released from prison

45
00:03:09.240 --> 00:03:13.719
in nineteen forty four, like fourteen year old Juanita Gunzanez,

46
00:03:13.879 --> 00:03:16.400
she entered the event tour school for girls in nineteen

47
00:03:16.400 --> 00:03:19.960
forty three and she was released or paroled in nineteen

48
00:03:20.000 --> 00:03:22.240
forty four, but she remained as a ward of the

49
00:03:22.319 --> 00:03:26.120
state until her twenty first birthday in nineteen forty eight.

50
00:03:26.280 --> 00:03:29.120
That's what you talked about in that episode. Two. How

51
00:03:29.919 --> 00:03:34.080
even past like adult age, they remained, were forced to

52
00:03:34.080 --> 00:03:39.680
remain in those type of places, Yes, exactly. And this

53
00:03:40.120 --> 00:03:42.800
was a whole four years after the men were released.

54
00:03:43.039 --> 00:03:47.319
Because of people versus Samora, and for these twenty two

55
00:03:47.400 --> 00:03:50.639
Mexican youth who were indicted the men, justice would be

56
00:03:50.680 --> 00:03:52.960
in uphill battle from the moment they were brought in

57
00:03:53.000 --> 00:03:57.919
from questioning. As we said last episode, six hundred were

58
00:03:58.000 --> 00:04:00.840
rounded up during the investigation just because of how they

59
00:04:00.879 --> 00:04:05.360
looked II wearing a zoot suit, looking Mexican, being brown

60
00:04:05.400 --> 00:04:08.479
in a zoot suit. But those who were eventually charged

61
00:04:08.599 --> 00:04:13.400
and facing trial the twenty two they all described unjust

62
00:04:13.479 --> 00:04:18.920
police interrogations. After eighteen year old Ahelpadia was taken to

63
00:04:19.000 --> 00:04:22.839
the Firestone substation for interrogation, he was ushered into a

64
00:04:22.920 --> 00:04:24.959
room where he was surrounded by a group of police

65
00:04:24.959 --> 00:04:28.079
officers who were all asking questions at the same time.

66
00:04:28.759 --> 00:04:31.839
How do you even know who to answer exactly? Oh,

67
00:04:31.920 --> 00:04:35.319
they did on purpose. Yes, yes. He refused to talk,

68
00:04:35.759 --> 00:04:38.160
and that's when they began to slap and punch him,

69
00:04:38.600 --> 00:04:41.920
all of them. When one of the punches knocked him

70
00:04:41.920 --> 00:04:43.720
out of his seat, one of the officers yelled for

71
00:04:43.800 --> 00:04:45.680
him to sit down so they could hit him some more.

72
00:04:46.399 --> 00:04:49.839
When he finally sit down, the same officer told him, quote,

73
00:04:49.920 --> 00:04:53.040
you Mexicans think you're smart. You guys never fight fair.

74
00:04:53.319 --> 00:04:55.439
End quote. As a bunch of police officers all were

75
00:04:55.519 --> 00:04:57.839
hitting them at the same time, talking about fighting fair.

76
00:04:58.279 --> 00:05:01.399
They were literally all yelling at him and then all

77
00:05:01.519 --> 00:05:04.279
hitting him at the same time and daring to speak

78
00:05:04.279 --> 00:05:08.720
on fairness, yes, the audacity of these people. Then another

79
00:05:08.759 --> 00:05:11.959
officer told him, quote, we ought to shoot every Mexican

80
00:05:12.000 --> 00:05:15.639
dog like you, and the quote of course he said that,

81
00:05:15.879 --> 00:05:20.399
And this is just the questioning the interrogation phase, yes,

82
00:05:21.480 --> 00:05:28.120
which is illegal and therefore would could not technically be

83
00:05:28.279 --> 00:05:33.480
used as evidence ideally, you know, yeah, you know, not

84
00:05:33.519 --> 00:05:37.839
even ideally, like that's the standard, right, right. Actually, I

85
00:05:37.879 --> 00:05:39.319
don't know when that was put in place, but I

86
00:05:39.319 --> 00:05:42.079
think it was in place already, you know, I'm not

87
00:05:42.160 --> 00:05:47.319
sure forced confessions. This is essentially a first confession, right,

88
00:05:47.399 --> 00:05:50.600
this is yeah, yeah, all of these were, but I

89
00:05:50.639 --> 00:05:54.519
don't know when even then though, like this almost exact scenario,

90
00:05:54.920 --> 00:05:58.079
but worse would play out in the future in like

91
00:05:58.439 --> 00:06:03.480
the Central Park five for instance, right right, That's why

92
00:06:03.480 --> 00:06:07.160
I don't know exactly when they actually started, and I

93
00:06:07.160 --> 00:06:10.720
think in some cases they still don't follow this. Yeah,

94
00:06:10.759 --> 00:06:20.279
you know. Yeah. When eighteen year old Johnny Mathoos was

95
00:06:20.480 --> 00:06:23.199
apprehended to be brought into the station, he was searched

96
00:06:23.639 --> 00:06:26.240
and two officers found ninety eight dollars on him, and

97
00:06:26.279 --> 00:06:28.639
they refused to believe that it was his when he

98
00:06:28.680 --> 00:06:32.360
said he earned it working, so instead they insisted that

99
00:06:32.399 --> 00:06:34.519
he had stolen it, and they beat him up in

100
00:06:34.560 --> 00:06:37.040
an attempt to force to confess to having stolen the

101
00:06:37.160 --> 00:06:39.920
ninety eight dollars. Mind you, he was being brought into

102
00:06:39.959 --> 00:06:43.480
the station to be interrogated on about the murder of

103
00:06:43.680 --> 00:06:47.839
Josid Yas. Yeah, what do these ninety do? You said?

104
00:06:47.879 --> 00:06:50.199
Ninety eight dollars? Yeah? What does he have to do

105
00:06:50.319 --> 00:06:52.920
with this? They searched him, they took his money, and

106
00:06:52.959 --> 00:06:55.920
they beat him to try and get him to confess

107
00:06:55.920 --> 00:06:59.040
that he stole the ninety eight dollars. He ended up

108
00:06:59.040 --> 00:07:03.839
passing out instead of confessing. Also, he, like most of

109
00:07:03.920 --> 00:07:07.199
the twenty two that were brought in, had no criminal

110
00:07:07.240 --> 00:07:11.120
record prior to the Sleepy Lagoon case. And the few

111
00:07:11.160 --> 00:07:13.519
that did have criminal records, I would personally think it

112
00:07:13.560 --> 00:07:16.279
was like, not a real record, but because of racism.

113
00:07:16.519 --> 00:07:19.920
And I will give you the Leva's brothers as an example. So,

114
00:07:20.480 --> 00:07:22.759
some time before all of this went down the Sleepy

115
00:07:22.839 --> 00:07:26.120
Lagoon case, they were driving their dad's car and they

116
00:07:26.120 --> 00:07:29.319
had been pulled over. Police refused to believe it was

117
00:07:29.360 --> 00:07:31.720
their dad's car and booked them and kept them in

118
00:07:31.800 --> 00:07:34.240
jail until their dad was able to get to the

119
00:07:34.279 --> 00:07:38.480
station with proof that this was his car. Wow. And

120
00:07:38.519 --> 00:07:41.680
so they were released, but this incident became part of

121
00:07:41.720 --> 00:07:47.000
the record. That's not right. No. Another one of them,

122
00:07:47.160 --> 00:07:52.480
Joseph Valenzuola, was told by Deputy Sheriff Miguel Gallardo, quote,

123
00:07:52.480 --> 00:07:54.920
you had better talk, you bastard, or were gonna fuck

124
00:07:55.000 --> 00:07:58.360
you up. End quote. At the same time, Deputy Sheriff

125
00:07:58.480 --> 00:08:03.160
Raymond Hopkinson slapped him around and shouted, quote, you're not

126
00:08:03.240 --> 00:08:05.439
so tough around here when you haven't got a gang

127
00:08:05.639 --> 00:08:09.959
end quote. Wow. They also called him cholo and dirty Mexican,

128
00:08:10.000 --> 00:08:14.720
among other things, all while again slapping him around. And

129
00:08:14.800 --> 00:08:20.319
Benny Alvarez, Eugene Garpio, Manuel Regues, Lupe Levas, and Henry

130
00:08:20.560 --> 00:08:24.040
would all come forward with similar accounts of harsh treatment

131
00:08:24.160 --> 00:08:28.079
during interrogations and also wild incarcerated. And it was so

132
00:08:28.160 --> 00:08:31.800
bad that during the trial the assistant district attorney stopped

133
00:08:31.800 --> 00:08:34.399
this line of questioning. He's like, we're not going to

134
00:08:34.399 --> 00:08:38.120
ask this anymore because, like the defendants continued to say,

135
00:08:38.200 --> 00:08:41.799
we were b and forced into saying these things, and

136
00:08:41.840 --> 00:08:44.279
then the officers would be brought to testify. So like

137
00:08:44.440 --> 00:08:48.279
Deputy Sheriff Gayardo Hopkins Hopkins and whatever I said earlier,

138
00:08:48.559 --> 00:08:51.080
and Chief Clem Peoples. They were all brought to the

139
00:08:51.080 --> 00:08:53.440
stant to testify, and they all denied having laid a

140
00:08:53.480 --> 00:08:56.240
hand on the boys, but everyone knew they were lying.

141
00:08:56.679 --> 00:09:00.279
And this was especially frustrating for Anna Zachik and Read

142
00:09:00.360 --> 00:09:04.159
Levas's lawyer, who insisted that she be allowed to take

143
00:09:04.159 --> 00:09:07.000
the witness stand and testify that she had found Henry

144
00:09:07.080 --> 00:09:10.519
leave as her clients lumped forward in a semi conscious state,

145
00:09:10.960 --> 00:09:15.320
shirt covered in blood, lips swollen, and nose bleeding. Oh wow,

146
00:09:15.879 --> 00:09:19.360
after having gone into the interrogation room when the police left. Damn,

147
00:09:19.440 --> 00:09:21.279
she should have called somebody else to see it, because

148
00:09:21.320 --> 00:09:25.080
I think there's like dumb right. She couldn't. Yeah, she couldn't.

149
00:09:25.159 --> 00:09:28.519
She dumb rules, dumb rules. Yeah, should have called someone

150
00:09:28.559 --> 00:09:30.720
else to witness this, and then that person could have

151
00:09:30.759 --> 00:09:33.399
been called to the stand, right because Yeah, the judge

152
00:09:33.480 --> 00:09:36.879
Josh Frike, of course denied this ridiculous request, is what

153
00:09:36.960 --> 00:09:40.440
he called it, which it is not. Well, these are

154
00:09:41.480 --> 00:09:44.919
the law of people. They follow the protocols and stuff.

155
00:09:44.919 --> 00:09:47.039
It's just not It's one of those things that's not allowed,

156
00:09:47.080 --> 00:09:49.799
you know, like attorney whatever, client, privileged like that kind

157
00:09:49.799 --> 00:09:54.320
of shit. Yeah, but she herself saw this right, and

158
00:09:54.480 --> 00:09:57.159
during the trial a test the fact that he told

159
00:09:57.240 --> 00:10:00.399
sheriff clean people's yes to all of the question he

160
00:10:00.519 --> 00:10:04.120
was asked because he didn't want to get in their

161
00:10:04.120 --> 00:10:06.519
ass kicked. Yeah, he didn't want to get hit anymore,

162
00:10:06.519 --> 00:10:09.240
and that everything except his name and his address was

163
00:10:09.279 --> 00:10:14.159
a lie. Damn. And the police force confessions out of

164
00:10:14.159 --> 00:10:18.039
all of them, either through manipulations or outright coercions. Some

165
00:10:18.080 --> 00:10:21.159
of the manipulative methods that they used were to isolate

166
00:10:21.159 --> 00:10:24.519
the ones who continue to resist, like not talk, by

167
00:10:24.600 --> 00:10:28.080
not lating them talk to anyone, including their lawyers, which

168
00:10:28.120 --> 00:10:32.720
is not allowed, which is illegal. Yeah, yeah, and they

169
00:10:32.879 --> 00:10:37.679
only let them see anyone until they confess. That's not right. No,

170
00:10:38.519 --> 00:10:40.799
you're supposed to have the right to talk to your lawyer,

171
00:10:41.519 --> 00:10:43.919
and you can. You're supposed to be able to end

172
00:10:44.000 --> 00:10:46.279
question at any point by saying I want to talk

173
00:10:46.320 --> 00:10:50.000
to my lawyer exactly. They also booked some of the

174
00:10:50.039 --> 00:10:53.559
boys under different names, which made their time in jail

175
00:10:53.639 --> 00:10:56.120
longer and made it difficult for their families and legal

176
00:10:56.120 --> 00:11:01.879
team to folate them. Yes, which is very much not allowed. Again,

177
00:11:02.200 --> 00:11:04.480
was this like an error or on purpose. Oh no,

178
00:11:04.559 --> 00:11:07.039
this was on purpose under the wrong name. So they

179
00:11:07.080 --> 00:11:11.399
went and talk to their legal counsel. Yeah. Wow. During

180
00:11:11.399 --> 00:11:13.879
the trial, the defendants were not allowed to sit near

181
00:11:13.919 --> 00:11:17.879
their illegal teams, let alone talk to them. That is

182
00:11:17.919 --> 00:11:21.840
that allowed? No, No, it's not right. The judge made

183
00:11:21.879 --> 00:11:25.279
the decision to seat them all the defendants, because there

184
00:11:25.320 --> 00:11:27.679
were not many of them, seat them together in a

185
00:11:28.080 --> 00:11:30.480
bench in the front of the court. Isn't this why,

186
00:11:30.639 --> 00:11:34.360
like masks hearings masks, I don't know what you call them, like,

187
00:11:34.399 --> 00:11:37.200
they should eat have their own because they're not, like

188
00:11:37.240 --> 00:11:38.799
you said, they're not able to sit next to each

189
00:11:38.960 --> 00:11:42.399
their attorneys and whatnot. Yeah. So two of them, in

190
00:11:42.440 --> 00:11:44.919
the end, I want to say twelve were officially charged,

191
00:11:47.600 --> 00:11:49.840
but two that were not part of this twelve were

192
00:11:49.840 --> 00:11:53.279
able to get separate trials that were not part of

193
00:11:53.320 --> 00:11:58.240
these twelve and they were found not guilty. And it's

194
00:11:58.240 --> 00:12:00.639
probably because they had an actual access to their legal

195
00:12:00.639 --> 00:12:05.559
team and they had a right fair trial exactly. But

196
00:12:05.679 --> 00:12:09.120
because all of these boys were trying together, the judge

197
00:12:09.120 --> 00:12:11.639
made the choice to have them seated in front and

198
00:12:11.679 --> 00:12:15.240
then the defense team at the defense bench further away

199
00:12:15.240 --> 00:12:19.679
from them. Wow. And this was a jury trial, right, yes, yes,

200
00:12:19.919 --> 00:12:22.240
he's like, oh, this isn't going to impeded their access

201
00:12:22.240 --> 00:12:25.279
to a the legal team. But it did. How Wow, Yeah,

202
00:12:25.320 --> 00:12:28.240
it absolutely did, because they weren't allowed to get up

203
00:12:28.279 --> 00:12:31.000
and just talk to their legal team. Yeah. So yeah,

204
00:12:31.039 --> 00:12:35.840
it absolutely impeded that, right, And so on top of that,

205
00:12:36.960 --> 00:12:40.159
they were also not allowed to change their clothes. The

206
00:12:40.240 --> 00:12:45.159
district attorney requested this on the grounds that the jury

207
00:12:45.159 --> 00:12:48.120
should see the defendants wearing the zoot suit that was

208
00:12:48.159 --> 00:12:52.919
obviously worn only by hudlums. Wow. And the judge agreed,

209
00:12:53.519 --> 00:12:56.399
and so he specifically ordered after hearing this from the

210
00:12:56.440 --> 00:12:59.840
district attorney, like, yeah, they can't change their clothes. And

211
00:13:00.080 --> 00:13:03.840
this is like after a lot of already a negative

212
00:13:03.840 --> 00:13:08.279
portrayal of the zutsuit on the rise. So yeah, it's

213
00:13:08.360 --> 00:13:12.080
like someone who is being accused of gang related crimes

214
00:13:12.519 --> 00:13:15.879
being forced to wear their gang outfit clothes. Yeah, you know,

215
00:13:16.000 --> 00:13:20.720
exactly exactly. And so on top of the clear picture

216
00:13:20.759 --> 00:13:26.200
that has had already been painted about these dangerous zutsuit

217
00:13:26.240 --> 00:13:30.000
wearing youth, each defendant was required to stand up anytime

218
00:13:30.039 --> 00:13:32.399
their name was mentioned, no matter how small the statement,

219
00:13:32.440 --> 00:13:37.120
they had to stand up. That's just to like humiliate

220
00:13:37.159 --> 00:13:39.799
them or what like what Yeah, basically I mean there's

221
00:13:39.879 --> 00:13:41.399
I really don't see another point to that, and I

222
00:13:41.399 --> 00:13:44.879
couldn't find like the reasoning behind it either, So to me,

223
00:13:45.000 --> 00:13:47.759
that is, I guess maybe like so the jury could

224
00:13:47.759 --> 00:13:50.279
know who was who, but still like I don't understand

225
00:13:50.279 --> 00:13:52.639
at some point it's like not necessarily anymore because not

226
00:13:52.720 --> 00:13:55.440
really right, like you would think does that matter? Then

227
00:13:55.480 --> 00:13:58.720
you would have since or tried each of them individually separately.

228
00:13:58.879 --> 00:14:03.320
Exactly on top of that, the jury all her testimonies,

229
00:14:03.399 --> 00:14:06.679
like that of Lieutenant Edward duran Ares of the La

230
00:14:06.759 --> 00:14:10.639
County Sheriff's Department who testified before the grand jury, quote

231
00:14:11.360 --> 00:14:13.879
like one cannot change the sponsor of a leopard Mexican

232
00:14:13.919 --> 00:14:17.360
American youth share the same total disregard for human lives,

233
00:14:17.639 --> 00:14:21.679
like the assets who displayed in performing human sacrifices. All

234
00:14:21.720 --> 00:14:25.360
he knows and feels is a desire to rich kill

235
00:14:25.840 --> 00:14:29.639
that LEAs to let blood end quote real rich coming

236
00:14:29.679 --> 00:14:34.120
from a LA sheriff. Yeah, and like this should have

237
00:14:34.120 --> 00:14:36.919
been like objected on the standard, like is this relevant?

238
00:14:37.000 --> 00:14:40.200
Like are you talking about aztecs right now? Right? The

239
00:14:40.240 --> 00:14:43.960
ft like coming from someone who in their lineage is

240
00:14:44.000 --> 00:14:49.000
a whole genocidal slavery, and you know, like, what the hell?

241
00:14:49.759 --> 00:14:53.200
But he didn't stop there. His testimony ended by saying, quote,

242
00:14:53.440 --> 00:14:57.120
whenever the Mexican element receives swift and shut punishment, he

243
00:14:57.279 --> 00:15:01.279
then and only then respects authority end quote. Oh my god,

244
00:15:01.399 --> 00:15:04.200
you know, how did this line of testimony, this line

245
00:15:04.240 --> 00:15:08.320
of however, this state, these statements arose, like how this

246
00:15:08.559 --> 00:15:13.600
kind of questioning houses allowed? Did nobody object? Was objection denied?

247
00:15:14.039 --> 00:15:16.799
Like what does it have to do with anything? Right? Right?

248
00:15:17.039 --> 00:15:23.919
I'd be like, object object my favor. I'm offended the

249
00:15:24.279 --> 00:15:29.759
book around baseless questioning or something that tint of stuff

250
00:15:30.159 --> 00:15:34.120
I can make. Lawyer shows exactly I watched Law and Order.

251
00:15:34.240 --> 00:15:37.159
No I haven't. Actually I haven't watched much Lawyer shows.

252
00:15:37.679 --> 00:15:45.559
No me either, And they continue to hear things like that,

253
00:15:45.600 --> 00:15:51.759
Captain Vernon ridiculous though. Yes. Captain Vernon Rasmussen, in charge

254
00:15:51.840 --> 00:15:56.360
of the LAPD's Homicide Subversive Bureau, shared the same views

255
00:15:56.440 --> 00:15:59.039
and said basically the same thing to the jury, these

256
00:15:59.080 --> 00:16:04.159
are the same fools and to train worldwide after like

257
00:16:04.720 --> 00:16:08.200
regime toppling and whatnot? Yeah, yeah, or like the same

258
00:16:08.360 --> 00:16:13.519
foods who go around abusing the citizens of la Oh. Yeah, yeah,

259
00:16:13.600 --> 00:16:18.080
that's when he said, Viga, that's a given. During his testimony,

260
00:16:18.120 --> 00:16:20.919
he said that too many Mexican American youths were being

261
00:16:21.039 --> 00:16:23.879
released on parole rather than doing hard time, and that

262
00:16:24.000 --> 00:16:28.000
leniency only made the American judicial system look like a joke.

263
00:16:28.480 --> 00:16:31.080
How is this What does this statement have to do

264
00:16:31.159 --> 00:16:36.639
with anything? Again? Why was this statement even allowed objection relevance? Exactly?

265
00:16:36.639 --> 00:16:38.159
There's one of the words I'll try to think of

266
00:16:38.240 --> 00:16:42.639
before mm hmmm hmm. And he ended his own testimony

267
00:16:42.639 --> 00:16:45.559
by saying that only swift and harsh punishment for the

268
00:16:45.600 --> 00:16:49.440
Mexican element would deter youths from developing attitudes that were

269
00:16:49.799 --> 00:16:54.000
exactly contrary to those adopted by the respectable Caucasian element.

270
00:16:54.200 --> 00:16:56.600
Oh my god, No, I'm telling you because I've been

271
00:16:56.639 --> 00:17:01.759
reading this book about policing worldwide, and I've been saying, yeah,

272
00:17:01.759 --> 00:17:04.200
that's right. Yeah, it's kind of hard to read because

273
00:17:04.279 --> 00:17:06.759
I'm dumb, so it's taking me a long time, and

274
00:17:06.880 --> 00:17:09.359
of course, like one third of the way, it's gonna

275
00:17:09.400 --> 00:17:11.319
take me a long time to finish it because it's

276
00:17:11.359 --> 00:17:13.240
hard to read and understand. I have to read everything

277
00:17:13.319 --> 00:17:14.680
like a bunch of times and look up a bunch

278
00:17:14.720 --> 00:17:16.599
of words. Anyway, I was gonna say, whenever you had

279
00:17:16.640 --> 00:17:18.400
to pause to look up some words, it takes a

280
00:17:18.440 --> 00:17:20.880
little bit longer. Yeah, And man, do I have a

281
00:17:20.920 --> 00:17:22.960
list going of all the words I don't know before?

282
00:17:23.559 --> 00:17:26.400
But yeah, this is the kind of stuff they talk about.

283
00:17:26.519 --> 00:17:33.240
Like cops here like fucking Midwest went to uh uh,

284
00:17:33.559 --> 00:17:36.599
Japan after World War two, the Middle East, like all

285
00:17:36.640 --> 00:17:41.039
these places to train those police. But it was every

286
00:17:41.079 --> 00:17:48.279
they were training in identifying and stopping subserving subservience. Oh,

287
00:17:48.359 --> 00:17:55.359
I mean, which really meant it meant anyone that anything, unions,

288
00:17:56.279 --> 00:17:59.680
you teachers, you know, on and off any if you

289
00:17:59.720 --> 00:18:03.319
start for anything, right, But yeah, I mean look at

290
00:18:03.319 --> 00:18:07.519
that there was an LAPD Homicide Subversive Bureau, Right. That's

291
00:18:07.559 --> 00:18:10.759
why when you said subversive, I mentioned like, oh, this

292
00:18:10.839 --> 00:18:12.640
is probably the same cops because it was literally like

293
00:18:12.720 --> 00:18:16.680
city cops, like regular regular fucking cops going to fucking

294
00:18:17.160 --> 00:18:21.519
another country and teaching them how to terrorize their citizens,

295
00:18:22.079 --> 00:18:27.599
I mean police their citizens, yes, but same thing, no. Yeah. Yeah,

296
00:18:27.759 --> 00:18:31.319
And so let's talk about the judge presiding over this case,

297
00:18:31.599 --> 00:18:33.119
because I was about to ask that, and then I

298
00:18:33.119 --> 00:18:34.680
went on and on about something else, but I have

299
00:18:34.960 --> 00:18:37.039
meaning to ask, so good, well you know what I'm

300
00:18:37.039 --> 00:18:42.359
including it, which obviously him being the judge played a

301
00:18:42.440 --> 00:18:46.599
role in the outcome of this trial. So judge, sorry,

302
00:18:46.720 --> 00:18:51.559
I wasn't gonna go side journey here, but judges really determined,

303
00:18:51.920 --> 00:18:54.680
like obviously the outcome of things. But reminds me of

304
00:18:54.680 --> 00:19:00.279
the judge who gave Brock the rapist brook Turner. Yes,

305
00:19:00.920 --> 00:19:06.799
that light ass sentence. Judge Charles Williams Frick was sixty

306
00:19:06.839 --> 00:19:09.279
before the trial began, and before being a judge, he

307
00:19:09.480 --> 00:19:13.039
was a prosecutor in the La County District Attorney's office.

308
00:19:13.920 --> 00:19:16.720
He was listening to his buddies then when they were

309
00:19:16.720 --> 00:19:20.519
presenting the case. Of course, oh yeah, yeah, no, which

310
00:19:20.519 --> 00:19:25.079
is how these things happen, of course, or rose quickly, Yeah,

311
00:19:25.720 --> 00:19:29.240
he rose quickly through the rinks and became chief Trial Deputy,

312
00:19:29.319 --> 00:19:31.559
and then you know, eventually judge and by the time,

313
00:19:31.839 --> 00:19:35.160
on and on, Yeah, by the time the Sleepy Logoon

314
00:19:35.240 --> 00:19:38.240
trial came to him, he had already earned the nickname

315
00:19:39.519 --> 00:19:44.920
San Quentin Frick Wow, for having sent more people to

316
00:19:44.960 --> 00:19:48.720
San Quentin State Prison than any other judge in California history,

317
00:19:48.799 --> 00:19:50.440
at least at the time, I don't know if anyone

318
00:19:50.440 --> 00:19:53.920
surpassed him. I didn't live. And I guess for those

319
00:19:53.960 --> 00:19:57.000
of who don't know, sant Quentin is like an infamous

320
00:19:57.039 --> 00:20:01.119
prison in California, I feel like, well all of our

321
00:20:01.160 --> 00:20:05.680
California listeners know. Yeah and so yeah, that was his nickname,

322
00:20:05.880 --> 00:20:10.640
Sam Quentin Frick and this reputation of his did not

323
00:20:10.759 --> 00:20:14.680
waiver during this trial. He ordered the defendants to all

324
00:20:14.720 --> 00:20:17.200
stay in two benches while their legal teams stayed at

325
00:20:17.200 --> 00:20:20.839
the defense bench. And speaking of the defense team, due

326
00:20:20.880 --> 00:20:24.319
to money issues, many of them had to share inexperienced

327
00:20:24.359 --> 00:20:28.480
lawyers public defenders. Then those who couldn't afford that were

328
00:20:28.640 --> 00:20:33.960
given yeah, court appointed public defenders. So Anthony Covillo, who

329
00:20:33.960 --> 00:20:37.799
represented Joe Errera and Lupe Rosco, he was a retired

330
00:20:37.839 --> 00:20:41.559
police officer, police officer turned lawyer, but he had so

331
00:20:41.759 --> 00:20:44.559
little core room experience that he rarely spoke, and when

332
00:20:44.599 --> 00:20:48.519
he did, he sounded so unsure, so unconfident and so hesitant.

333
00:20:48.960 --> 00:20:54.240
Oh my god, that's terrible. Yes, absolutely, like that's like

334
00:20:54.359 --> 00:20:56.200
the worst. And this was like so many paid. This

335
00:20:56.279 --> 00:20:59.200
wasn't like a court if all the family could like

336
00:20:59.200 --> 00:21:03.880
pull together, and that's who they could afford Anna Zachik,

337
00:21:04.119 --> 00:21:07.160
who represented and I may be mispronouncing her name. I

338
00:21:07.200 --> 00:21:09.880
don't know, and I'm sorry if I am. Anyway, she

339
00:21:09.960 --> 00:21:14.359
represented Henry Leivas, Victor Segovia and Edward Grampre. And she

340
00:21:14.599 --> 00:21:20.000
was a former silent film actress okay, yes, who actually

341
00:21:20.000 --> 00:21:23.839
had a tiny role in the silent film Birth of

342
00:21:23.880 --> 00:21:27.839
a Nation under her stage name Olga Gray. Oh my god,

343
00:21:28.000 --> 00:21:30.599
I was not expecting to hear anything about the birth

344
00:21:30.640 --> 00:21:33.240
of a nation here. I don't mean neither, but probably

345
00:21:33.400 --> 00:21:37.279
just creeps back up randomly, you know, ever ever Omnison,

346
00:21:37.319 --> 00:21:43.000
ever present the Birth of a Nation? Yes, And while

347
00:21:43.119 --> 00:21:47.920
she lacked legal skills, she had the necessary charisma. But

348
00:21:48.079 --> 00:21:51.839
unfortunately she lacked legal skills. But she was a champion

349
00:21:51.880 --> 00:21:53.799
for the boys, she really, I mean, I guess she

350
00:21:53.880 --> 00:21:56.720
tried her best. She tried her best. But yeah, she's

351
00:21:56.799 --> 00:22:00.000
making up for being a birth of a nation, right right?

352
00:22:00.160 --> 00:22:04.519
And yeah, but she said they didn't have the legal

353
00:22:04.559 --> 00:22:08.960
expertise because she was also a fairly new lawyer. In total,

354
00:22:09.000 --> 00:22:12.200
there were seven lawyers who were unfortunately were not working

355
00:22:12.319 --> 00:22:15.079
very well together in strategy, and they were like bickering

356
00:22:15.119 --> 00:22:20.799
in the courtroom. It's embarrassing. Yeah, they didn't have like

357
00:22:20.839 --> 00:22:25.319
a strong front and they should have. The prosecution, on

358
00:22:25.359 --> 00:22:28.880
the other hand, had two very experienced prosecutors, Assistant District

359
00:22:28.920 --> 00:22:33.039
Attorney Clyde Schumacher and John Barnes, and they had a

360
00:22:33.079 --> 00:22:36.640
simple and cohesive strategy. Lay out what little evidence they had,

361
00:22:37.160 --> 00:22:40.759
bring out the Lulio the ass and Lino theas father

362
00:22:40.799 --> 00:22:43.000
and brother of Foselias, so the jury could gain an

363
00:22:43.039 --> 00:22:46.480
understanding of Joselias's life, and then bring out the chief

364
00:22:46.519 --> 00:22:50.359
autopsy surgeon for La County to establish the cause of death.

365
00:22:51.400 --> 00:22:54.759
So was that real the cause of Well, the autopsy

366
00:22:54.759 --> 00:22:57.440
surgeon shared what he thought the cons of death was,

367
00:22:57.480 --> 00:22:59.240
but there was just no way to link it back

368
00:22:59.279 --> 00:23:04.799
to the defender, right right, right, Yeah, And the last

369
00:23:04.839 --> 00:23:08.640
step was to bring out the women slash young girls, sorry,

370
00:23:08.720 --> 00:23:13.240
young teens of the thirty eighth Street group. I'm hesitant

371
00:23:13.240 --> 00:23:15.000
to call them a gang because they didn't call themselves

372
00:23:15.000 --> 00:23:19.799
a gang, and they'll get your party. So they brought

373
00:23:19.839 --> 00:23:22.599
out they tried to bring out fifteen year old Quanita Gonzalez,

374
00:23:22.640 --> 00:23:26.920
sixteen year old bet Betty Nunez, and Cummings, sixteen year

375
00:23:26.920 --> 00:23:30.359
old Josephine Gonzalez, fourteen year old Berta Aguilad, and eighteen

376
00:23:30.440 --> 00:23:32.519
year old daughter Barrios. They tried to bring them out

377
00:23:32.519 --> 00:23:35.240
and they all refused to testify. Oh wow, but you

378
00:23:35.240 --> 00:23:38.359
know that's street code, you know. Yeah, they didn't want

379
00:23:38.359 --> 00:23:40.640
to snitch and they didn't want to testify. They didn't

380
00:23:40.640 --> 00:23:42.480
want to be the reason that their brothers, friends and

381
00:23:42.519 --> 00:23:47.799
boyfriends would be sent to jail. So yeah, many of

382
00:23:47.799 --> 00:23:51.079
them were. They were. Also, they were asked continuously if

383
00:23:51.079 --> 00:23:53.200
they were a gang, and none of them would agree.

384
00:23:53.240 --> 00:23:55.440
They're like, I've never heard anyone call us a gang.

385
00:23:55.880 --> 00:24:00.920
What's a gang? And so yeah, these girls never agreed

386
00:24:01.319 --> 00:24:03.440
or admitted they were part of a gang. They were

387
00:24:03.480 --> 00:24:06.240
just like, well, we're a group of friends. But the

388
00:24:06.279 --> 00:24:10.279
prosecution doubled down on this term gang. They really wanted

389
00:24:10.960 --> 00:24:14.200
to work with this growing fear of youth gangs roaming

390
00:24:14.319 --> 00:24:17.680
free and reaking havoc on the streets of La Like

391
00:24:17.720 --> 00:24:21.400
they that was what they wanted to pursue the jury

392
00:24:21.480 --> 00:24:24.640
of really, and so they tried to assert Henry Lavas

393
00:24:24.680 --> 00:24:27.599
as the leader of the thirty a street gang and

394
00:24:27.680 --> 00:24:30.799
another witnesses or defendants wh would corroborate this, like one

395
00:24:30.799 --> 00:24:33.240
of them was like, I don't know, we don't really

396
00:24:33.279 --> 00:24:36.599
pay much attention to Henry, but it was true that

397
00:24:36.640 --> 00:24:40.720
Henry was like a very outspoken, strong figure in this

398
00:24:40.799 --> 00:24:47.119
frame group. But regardless of the defendants and the witnesses

399
00:24:47.839 --> 00:24:50.160
saying no, we're not a gang, No, Henry's not the

400
00:24:50.240 --> 00:24:52.839
leader of our gang, the jury seemed sold on this

401
00:24:53.039 --> 00:24:56.839
gang idea and Henry levas being the leader of the gang,

402
00:24:57.920 --> 00:25:00.599
and the media was too. They paid extra attention to

403
00:25:00.680 --> 00:25:04.400
Henry leave us. And as for Henry, he was very

404
00:25:04.559 --> 00:25:06.920
I mean they all were, but unused to this much attention.

405
00:25:07.759 --> 00:25:10.079
And he he accidentally works in the way the public

406
00:25:10.160 --> 00:25:15.039
perceived him. He would accidentally laugh or cover his mouth

407
00:25:15.119 --> 00:25:18.960
to cover up a nervous laugh. Well that's just the

408
00:25:19.039 --> 00:25:25.640
case for really anybody in trial where there's there being

409
00:25:25.960 --> 00:25:29.079
constantly recorded and whatnot, because you don't know how to act,

410
00:25:29.119 --> 00:25:32.559
you actually your normal self. It reminds me of ever

411
00:25:32.640 --> 00:25:35.960
heard yes one who is prodie. I don't want to

412
00:25:36.000 --> 00:25:40.160
hear from you, Okay, But yeah, she was painted like

413
00:25:40.240 --> 00:25:43.200
to be like mocking him, laughing at him at core,

414
00:25:43.359 --> 00:25:46.559
But it was everything was like made to look that

415
00:25:46.599 --> 00:25:50.200
way and it wasn't actually like that. Yeah, and this

416
00:25:50.240 --> 00:25:53.039
is this, this is what happened to Henry. They would

417
00:25:53.160 --> 00:25:57.559
take pictures of him covering his mouth or like a smirk,

418
00:25:58.319 --> 00:26:01.559
and then they would publish these pictures with headlines like

419
00:26:01.799 --> 00:26:05.839
look at the smirk on Hrdlim's face. Of course, Yeah.

420
00:26:06.119 --> 00:26:09.640
To give you an exact headline, Sensation magazine wrote, quote

421
00:26:09.759 --> 00:26:13.480
ring leader of the bloodthirsty mob, smirking Henry le Bass

422
00:26:13.559 --> 00:26:16.720
stands accused of dealing fatal blows in murder end quote.

423
00:26:17.880 --> 00:26:25.279
And it's like, first, these are all lies. And just

424
00:26:25.359 --> 00:26:30.519
to add to how how biased and like full of

425
00:26:30.599 --> 00:26:35.200
lies the media was, this Sensation magazine that played a

426
00:26:35.240 --> 00:26:37.920
huge role in this trial and the portrayal of the defendants.

427
00:26:38.799 --> 00:26:41.559
Chief Clem Peoples has something to do with this magazine.

428
00:26:42.480 --> 00:26:44.599
Like I don't know if he was the contributor or

429
00:26:44.680 --> 00:26:48.160
like a like a producer, like like kind of stakeholder.

430
00:26:48.599 --> 00:26:51.880
He was involved in this magazine. Wow, he and he

431
00:26:51.960 --> 00:26:54.079
was one of the ones beating these defendants when they

432
00:26:54.119 --> 00:27:03.119
were and being interrogated. So keep that in mind. Okay,

433
00:27:03.200 --> 00:27:06.920
So while the media was working hard at this negative

434
00:27:06.920 --> 00:27:10.200
portrayal of the defendants, on the other side were their

435
00:27:10.240 --> 00:27:15.240
families who were fighting fighting this portrayal of them fighting

436
00:27:15.240 --> 00:27:22.960
for their you know, incarcerated friends' sons whatever. They were brothers,

437
00:27:23.960 --> 00:27:26.759
and they had the help of activists like LaRue McCormick,

438
00:27:26.880 --> 00:27:33.160
Josefina Fierro de Bright, Bert Corona, and Luisa Moreno. And

439
00:27:33.319 --> 00:27:38.000
the three women, LaRue McCormick, De Bright, and Luisa Moreno

440
00:27:38.039 --> 00:27:42.119
were instrumental in forming the Sleepy Lagoon Defense Committee. All

441
00:27:42.160 --> 00:27:46.079
three were already seasoned organizers and they had all been

442
00:27:46.119 --> 00:27:51.079
involved in the creation of El Congreblo Espanola, which we

443
00:27:51.200 --> 00:27:54.599
talked about, and I want to say the Pecan Strike

444
00:27:54.720 --> 00:27:58.559
episode is when this Congresso came up. But this is

445
00:27:58.559 --> 00:28:01.119
one of the first civil right organist Asian groups for

446
00:28:01.519 --> 00:28:06.440
Spanish speaking people in the US. And yeah, j Ferro

447
00:28:06.519 --> 00:28:11.200
de Bright, Luisa Moreno, and Louie McCormick, they were all

448
00:28:11.200 --> 00:28:16.200
involved in this. And so this organization was already working

449
00:28:16.240 --> 00:28:21.119
to address issues that Mexican immigrants and Mexican Americans face

450
00:28:21.440 --> 00:28:26.319
in the US, including police brutality and juvenile delinquency, and

451
00:28:26.400 --> 00:28:31.279
so naturally many of the members were interested in fighting

452
00:28:31.319 --> 00:28:36.559
for the boys, and so the Sleepy Lagoon Defense Committee

453
00:28:37.200 --> 00:28:41.119
was largely made up of members of El Congresso. The

454
00:28:41.240 --> 00:28:44.039
parents of the defendants of the Sleepy Lagoon trial turned

455
00:28:44.119 --> 00:28:49.799
to the s LC and Fierro de Bright and Moreno,

456
00:28:50.000 --> 00:28:53.799
and they all rose to the cause. Of course, Josavina

457
00:28:53.839 --> 00:28:57.359
Fierro de Bright used her connections in the entertainment industry

458
00:28:57.359 --> 00:29:02.079
to fundraise for the SLDC. Her husband was actually John Bright,

459
00:29:02.240 --> 00:29:05.559
a screenwriter and the co founder of the Screenwriters Guild

460
00:29:05.799 --> 00:29:09.759
of America, and she used this link. This connection she had,

461
00:29:10.160 --> 00:29:13.039
she also served as the link between the defendants' families

462
00:29:13.079 --> 00:29:16.960
and their supporters. She took Lupa Levas, the younger sister

463
00:29:17.000 --> 00:29:20.880
of Henry Levas, under her wing, and Lupa Levas became

464
00:29:20.960 --> 00:29:25.839
a spokesperson for the SLDC. Under Hoseefina Fierro de Bright's guidance.

465
00:29:26.240 --> 00:29:29.720
She went from being like the super reluctant speaker to

466
00:29:29.880 --> 00:29:36.079
a very effective and helpful orator. Amazing yeah, and she

467
00:29:36.160 --> 00:29:39.839
was making big impressions at fundraisers and public meetings, moving

468
00:29:39.839 --> 00:29:43.079
people to the cause. But even though she was like

469
00:29:43.160 --> 00:29:46.319
a reluctantly doing this at first and not very like

470
00:29:46.400 --> 00:29:50.720
confident in public speaking, even before all of this, she

471
00:29:50.880 --> 00:29:55.200
was like a like many children of immigrants. She was

472
00:29:55.240 --> 00:29:59.359
her parents, translator and proxy and so she was writing checks,

473
00:29:59.359 --> 00:30:02.920
money orders, talking to the light company, the Gaviali or experience.

474
00:30:03.559 --> 00:30:06.039
Yes she did. And then on top of that, she

475
00:30:08.039 --> 00:30:10.720
used these skills to take notes during the trial and

476
00:30:10.759 --> 00:30:14.799
translate for her mother and the defendants mothers. Yeah, so

477
00:30:14.799 --> 00:30:17.480
she was already, like you know, doing some work. But

478
00:30:17.640 --> 00:30:21.440
with Josefina, Lupe traveled all over California to speak and

479
00:30:21.559 --> 00:30:26.240
raise awareness for the defendants. She spoke at events in Hollywood,

480
00:30:26.319 --> 00:30:30.599
Santa Monica, and her mom trusted Josefina Fierro the Bright

481
00:30:30.640 --> 00:30:34.200
to keep an eye out on Lupe. And while this

482
00:30:34.480 --> 00:30:38.480
may not seem like impressive today, these were spaces that

483
00:30:38.880 --> 00:30:42.839
Lupe Levas was not able to enter back then as

484
00:30:42.839 --> 00:30:47.359
a Mexican woman, as a Mexican teen actresses who supported

485
00:30:47.400 --> 00:30:52.039
the cause, recruited by Josefina Fierrole Bright would give Lupe

486
00:30:52.160 --> 00:30:56.400
formal gowns so she could look elegant at these speaking engagements.

487
00:30:56.559 --> 00:31:01.359
Oh wow, yes, close, Lupa would never have access to

488
00:31:01.480 --> 00:31:04.960
make up. Like all of this. Lupa was even allowed

489
00:31:04.960 --> 00:31:07.160
to swim in the pool of one of these actresses,

490
00:31:08.359 --> 00:31:12.119
when she before had been forced to only be able

491
00:31:12.119 --> 00:31:14.519
to swim asleep lagoon because she was not allowed at

492
00:31:14.559 --> 00:31:18.960
public pools because of the no Mexican allowed signs. Yeah,

493
00:31:19.000 --> 00:31:22.200
so she said, quote, oh, we had the time of

494
00:31:22.240 --> 00:31:25.039
our lives about this, Like, yes, they were fighting for

495
00:31:25.079 --> 00:31:28.920
her brother, but also man was a time had Yes. Yes,

496
00:31:30.000 --> 00:31:33.279
Safina Fierro, the bry not only exposed her to a

497
00:31:33.359 --> 00:31:37.960
world beyond El Barrio, she also coached her in public speaking.

498
00:31:38.720 --> 00:31:40.400
And while these two you know, were at the forefront

499
00:31:40.559 --> 00:31:44.640
of the s l DC, there were so many women

500
00:31:44.720 --> 00:31:49.240
behind the scenes and they inspired like everyone to organize

501
00:31:49.359 --> 00:31:53.920
back at their Yate Street. Dora Bacca, Barrio's girlfriend of

502
00:31:53.960 --> 00:31:57.200
Henri Levas, she helped start the Youth Committee for the

503
00:31:57.200 --> 00:32:00.839
Defense of Mexican American Youth and she served as the

504
00:32:00.920 --> 00:32:05.039
vice chair and they would raise funds for the defendants.

505
00:32:05.720 --> 00:32:11.119
They also would collect scrap iron to support the war effort.

506
00:32:11.599 --> 00:32:17.680
Like they were out here working and they were doing

507
00:32:17.799 --> 00:32:19.839
so much to get the public opinion on the side

508
00:32:19.839 --> 00:32:23.880
of the boys. But they were also trying out legal

509
00:32:24.119 --> 00:32:29.319
you know methods, but unfortunately these didn't all work well,

510
00:32:29.480 --> 00:32:33.440
none of it worked right. Well, you don't see, okay.

511
00:32:35.200 --> 00:32:38.799
LaRue McCormick, one of her strategies super backfired, though at

512
00:32:38.839 --> 00:32:42.000
the time it was really a smart move because so

513
00:32:42.400 --> 00:32:47.119
she brought on lawyer George Shibley, a Libanese American lawyer

514
00:32:47.279 --> 00:32:50.359
who although he had only been graduated for six years

515
00:32:50.480 --> 00:32:53.079
out of law school, he had already established himself like

516
00:32:53.359 --> 00:32:57.480
for the cause, any cause. He took unpopular cases and

517
00:32:57.559 --> 00:33:00.480
he brought a fire with him that the defense really needed.

518
00:33:01.000 --> 00:33:03.880
And he had replaced a court appointed lawyer who just

519
00:33:04.640 --> 00:33:06.039
didn't know what they were doing. So he had to

520
00:33:06.039 --> 00:33:09.359
be better. He had to be better, and he had

521
00:33:09.400 --> 00:33:13.400
both legal expertise and charisma, which and apparently it was

522
00:33:13.400 --> 00:33:17.039
hard to find yes on a budget, yes, exactly. And

523
00:33:17.160 --> 00:33:20.440
Anna Zaschek was the lead beforehand, but he took lead

524
00:33:20.519 --> 00:33:23.880
because he had the expertise. But she didn't take this well.

525
00:33:24.559 --> 00:33:27.160
And so there was bickering, the bickering that already was

526
00:33:27.200 --> 00:33:30.400
happening and continued. But on top of that, this judge

527
00:33:30.440 --> 00:33:33.720
had it out for George Shibley and would like dismiss

528
00:33:33.880 --> 00:33:39.839
his objections, belittle him in front of the jury, and

529
00:33:40.039 --> 00:33:45.079
often Anna found herself playing referee between them and this

530
00:33:45.079 --> 00:33:47.240
this is like you're a fucking judge, dude, Like what

531
00:33:47.240 --> 00:33:51.359
are you doing this judge did not like George Shibley. Wow,

532
00:33:52.000 --> 00:33:56.839
but bickering aside, and the judges straight up like this

533
00:33:56.960 --> 00:34:00.599
statement for George Shibley, like all of that aside, Her

534
00:34:00.680 --> 00:34:03.920
and George Sibley were the boy's best chance, like they

535
00:34:04.000 --> 00:34:06.079
each had like the unique gifts that the rest of

536
00:34:06.079 --> 00:34:10.719
the legal team just was lacking. But the trial the

537
00:34:10.760 --> 00:34:15.440
combination of like all the continuous racist remarks that the

538
00:34:15.519 --> 00:34:18.400
jury was hearing, the bias from the judge, like this

539
00:34:18.480 --> 00:34:23.239
trial was not going well. Damn. The jury was very

540
00:34:23.280 --> 00:34:25.639
much not on their side, and it was pretty evident

541
00:34:26.639 --> 00:34:31.679
from their facial expressions and stuff. And then unfortually, the

542
00:34:31.760 --> 00:34:34.360
boy's behavior didn't help either. And I don't blame them.

543
00:34:34.400 --> 00:34:37.199
They're all like they're all young, but also they're like

544
00:34:37.280 --> 00:34:40.159
they're all from the same neighborhood, they all know each other.

545
00:34:40.280 --> 00:34:42.719
They're all I mean, they're all again young, so naturally

546
00:34:42.800 --> 00:34:46.119
like not as mature as like an older person might be.

547
00:34:47.039 --> 00:34:50.639
But they're all also like defiant, you know. So they

548
00:34:51.159 --> 00:34:54.079
they would poke each other, shove each other, bigger, talk

549
00:34:54.119 --> 00:34:57.719
and laugh, which only made the judge more angry and

550
00:34:57.800 --> 00:35:02.119
the jury disliked them even more. But even then, when

551
00:35:02.159 --> 00:35:06.440
George Shibley gave his closing statements, they were all hopeful

552
00:35:06.599 --> 00:35:09.880
and with reason because the defense had they couldn't establish

553
00:35:09.880 --> 00:35:12.159
a motive, they had no evidence, and they had no

554
00:35:12.239 --> 00:35:16.639
murder weapon. But this is just why, like there's already

555
00:35:16.639 --> 00:35:19.519
so much power with the state and you know, the

556
00:35:19.559 --> 00:35:23.119
prosecution and whatnot. Who is a state that they, yeah,

557
00:35:23.599 --> 00:35:25.639
barely have to do anything most of the time for

558
00:35:25.679 --> 00:35:28.440
the fucking jury to believe their assets, Like defendants are

559
00:35:28.440 --> 00:35:32.760
automatically guilty. And I understand that that makes people uncomfortable

560
00:35:32.800 --> 00:35:35.440
to hear that, because we live in a very procar

561
00:35:35.519 --> 00:35:41.480
storal society. Yeah, and of course, like victims deserve justice

562
00:35:41.519 --> 00:35:46.599
and all that, and so did the family of well

563
00:35:46.599 --> 00:35:52.360
said the yes, but I mean people deserve fair trials, right,

564
00:35:52.760 --> 00:35:59.280
they deserve to be proven guilty. Yeah, yeah, and without

565
00:35:59.320 --> 00:36:04.039
those things like what do you mean, yes again, no motive,

566
00:36:04.280 --> 00:36:08.239
no evidence, no murder weapon, right, necessary things to prove

567
00:36:08.280 --> 00:36:11.320
someone who's guilty. But he would think, yeah, that was

568
00:36:11.360 --> 00:36:14.920
my nexcellentence, you would think. And so after six days

569
00:36:14.920 --> 00:36:18.840
of deliberation, the court clerk Arthur Moore read the verdict.

570
00:36:19.239 --> 00:36:23.159
Four of the boys, Joe Carpio, Richard Gasolam, Edward Grandpre,

571
00:36:23.639 --> 00:36:29.320
Ruben Pena, and Danielle Verdugo were found not guilty. Andrew Acosta,

572
00:36:29.480 --> 00:36:36.000
Eugene Carpio, Victor Segobia, Benny Alvarez, and Joe Valentuela were

573
00:36:36.000 --> 00:36:42.440
found guilty of assault. Manuel Delgado, Johnny Matthous, Jack Melendez, Anghelpadia,

574
00:36:42.719 --> 00:36:47.800
Ismael Para, Manuel Reguez, Bobby Thompson, Henry Inostrosa, and Gus

575
00:36:47.840 --> 00:36:51.599
Samora were all found guilty of murder in the second

576
00:36:51.639 --> 00:36:54.360
degree and two counts of assault with the deadly weapon

577
00:36:54.440 --> 00:36:59.440
with intent to commit murder. Henry Levas, Jose Ruiz, and

578
00:36:59.599 --> 00:37:02.559
Robert the Yaz were each found guilty of murder in

579
00:37:02.599 --> 00:37:04.960
the first degree with two counts of assault with a

580
00:37:05.039 --> 00:37:08.679
deadly weapon with a tent to commit murder. And the

581
00:37:08.719 --> 00:37:11.679
boys and their families were all shocked by the verdict

582
00:37:11.719 --> 00:37:15.079
and they all started to weep because, yeah, like again,

583
00:37:15.199 --> 00:37:17.679
they they had to prove that they did this, and

584
00:37:17.719 --> 00:37:19.840
there was no proof. There was no they didn't really

585
00:37:19.840 --> 00:37:22.280
prove anything. No. All they did was say, look at

586
00:37:22.280 --> 00:37:25.119
these Mexican youths in theirs dude suits. They're all violent,

587
00:37:25.239 --> 00:37:28.519
like because they're Mexican, and that's it and they're it's

588
00:37:28.519 --> 00:37:31.480
in their blood. They can't help it. The next day,

589
00:37:31.639 --> 00:37:34.840
Judge Frick gave out their sentences, which back then shocked

590
00:37:34.880 --> 00:37:38.960
even the Attorney General of California. He gave Henry Levas,

591
00:37:38.960 --> 00:37:42.320
who said Luis and Robert Deegaz each life sentences at

592
00:37:42.320 --> 00:37:48.360
Saint Quentin. That's crazy. Manuel Delgado, John Matthous, Jack Melendez

593
00:37:48.360 --> 00:37:53.079
and Chelpadia, Ismael Barra, Manuel Riez, Bobbie Thompson, Henry nos

594
00:37:53.159 --> 00:37:55.760
Rosa and Casa Mora were all given five years to

595
00:37:55.840 --> 00:38:01.440
life at Saint Quentin, and andrew A Costa, EUGENEA Victor Segobia,

596
00:38:01.559 --> 00:38:04.400
Benny Alvarez and Joval Lenzuela were all given either one

597
00:38:04.480 --> 00:38:09.039
year accounty jail, road camp or the county farm Wow.

598
00:38:10.599 --> 00:38:14.159
And when the guilty version was announced, Sefa Fierro de

599
00:38:14.239 --> 00:38:18.719
Bright told them everyone like, hey, appeal process, that's a thing.

600
00:38:19.199 --> 00:38:22.679
Let's get to work. She instructed them to organize fundraisers

601
00:38:23.159 --> 00:38:26.199
and they all began to get to work. The mothers

602
00:38:26.760 --> 00:38:30.960
prepared and sold foods like damles on the street to

603
00:38:31.079 --> 00:38:35.880
raise funds. They would organize street dances or sorry, neighborhood dances,

604
00:38:35.920 --> 00:38:38.880
and the young men in the neighborhood would be security

605
00:38:39.000 --> 00:38:41.519
for the fundraiser dances. Everyone paid her mentioned at the

606
00:38:41.559 --> 00:38:46.719
door to raise funds for the defendants. Margaret deyas mother

607
00:38:46.840 --> 00:38:50.199
of Robert deyas one of the defendants. She would sell

608
00:38:50.239 --> 00:38:55.239
copies of this pamphlet that was written by Guy Endoor

609
00:38:56.239 --> 00:38:59.079
and this was the Sleepy Lagoon Mystery, and this was

610
00:38:59.079 --> 00:39:02.440
written to raise money. So she worked in selling this pamphlet.

611
00:39:03.760 --> 00:39:05.559
In the middle of this, the boys were, you know,

612
00:39:05.599 --> 00:39:08.760
behind bars, and they were seeing how their families rallied

613
00:39:08.760 --> 00:39:11.360
behind them, which did give them a sense of hope.

614
00:39:12.280 --> 00:39:15.039
The boys would write to Alice McGrath, who was the

615
00:39:15.119 --> 00:39:18.599
executive secretary of the SLDC, and just a little bit

616
00:39:18.599 --> 00:39:20.360
about her. She was twenty five when she began to

617
00:39:20.400 --> 00:39:23.679
work with the committee, and she started as the assistant

618
00:39:23.800 --> 00:39:27.320
assistant to the executive secretary, but she quickly rose up

619
00:39:27.320 --> 00:39:31.480
the ranks too. So she was so quote so outraged

620
00:39:31.480 --> 00:39:33.639
by the outcome of the trial that she was thoroughly

621
00:39:33.679 --> 00:39:36.800
committed to the appeal effort without regard to personal expense

622
00:39:36.880 --> 00:39:40.079
or concern. And quote and even though she lacked at

623
00:39:40.119 --> 00:39:43.039
evanced schooling, she held her own in a room full

624
00:39:43.079 --> 00:39:48.920
of people like lawyers, doctors, judges. Nice. Yeah, And she

625
00:39:49.000 --> 00:39:53.800
was instrumental in changing the Mexican American middle class perception

626
00:39:53.960 --> 00:39:58.440
of the convicted youth because they were like, oh no,

627
00:39:58.559 --> 00:40:01.480
these are hooligans. Like they don't like, you know, typical

628
00:40:01.599 --> 00:40:07.480
middle class views. And Alice would make frequent trips to

629
00:40:07.519 --> 00:40:09.719
go see them at her own expense. She would pay

630
00:40:09.760 --> 00:40:12.679
to go, deliver letters, go back and forth with the

631
00:40:12.719 --> 00:40:17.559
boys and their families. So through these frequent visits and

632
00:40:17.760 --> 00:40:20.760
packages and letters, she became like an older sister to

633
00:40:20.840 --> 00:40:26.280
many of them. And so let's see where I was,

634
00:40:26.280 --> 00:40:29.400
I there would go. Not long after his conviction, Henry

635
00:40:29.480 --> 00:40:33.400
Levas wrote to Alice, quote, I'm sorry things turned out

636
00:40:33.440 --> 00:40:36.079
the way that they did, as I had very rosy

637
00:40:36.159 --> 00:40:39.599
expectations for the future. Did you ever make a castle

638
00:40:39.639 --> 00:40:42.400
out of sand or mud when you were a very

639
00:40:42.400 --> 00:40:46.199
small girl in pigtails and took much pains and trouble

640
00:40:46.280 --> 00:40:48.199
to create it, and all of a sudden a beggar

641
00:40:48.320 --> 00:40:51.559
kid came over and gestrated for you. Well, my feelings

642
00:40:51.559 --> 00:40:54.639
are somewhat similar. It seems like the whole world just

643
00:40:54.679 --> 00:40:57.039
folded up on me and there's nothing I can do

644
00:40:57.079 --> 00:41:01.920
about it. And quote Wow. I was like, oh my god,

645
00:41:02.079 --> 00:41:06.400
not the castle and down someone comes and kicks it over. Yeah.

646
00:41:07.199 --> 00:41:13.599
That made me sad. It isn't not life? So no, seriously,

647
00:41:13.960 --> 00:41:17.199
isn't that life has like a non privileged Uh? I

648
00:41:17.280 --> 00:41:19.719
was a member of enterprise class. Yes, yes, thank you.

649
00:41:21.760 --> 00:41:26.559
Others except their fate with stoicism, and they wrote to

650
00:41:26.639 --> 00:41:29.239
Alice saying quote, I got in this, I might as

651
00:41:29.280 --> 00:41:32.119
well take it like a man. And while some of

652
00:41:32.119 --> 00:41:34.199
them were beginning to lose hope, they learned that the

653
00:41:34.280 --> 00:41:38.280
SLDC was still fighting for them, and this, of course

654
00:41:38.320 --> 00:41:42.800
renewed their spirits. While in prison, they all read The

655
00:41:42.840 --> 00:41:46.360
Sleepy Lagoten Mystery, which, again, like I said earlier, they

656
00:41:46.400 --> 00:41:50.719
had gotten famous screenwriter Guy Indoor to write. Actually I

657
00:41:50.760 --> 00:41:52.880
didn't think I said he was a famous screenwriter before.

658
00:41:53.440 --> 00:41:56.079
I don't think so. No, but yeah, famous screenwriter Guy

659
00:41:56.079 --> 00:41:59.760
Indor wrote The Sleeping Lagoon Mystery, and he purposely wrote

660
00:41:59.760 --> 00:42:03.239
it to be the opposite of a dry, scholarly piece

661
00:42:03.280 --> 00:42:05.840
about the trial. It was written to raise sympathy for

662
00:42:05.880 --> 00:42:08.880
the cause and ended with a statement quote the trial

663
00:42:09.000 --> 00:42:12.519
was not directed against suited Mexican youth. It was an

664
00:42:12.559 --> 00:42:15.519
attack upon your nation. It was a conspiracy against you.

665
00:42:15.639 --> 00:42:21.000
It was an attempt to assassinate your future. Wow, strong words.

666
00:42:21.280 --> 00:42:24.800
Yeah yeah, And while many could see like oh wow,

667
00:42:24.840 --> 00:42:28.320
what an exaggeration, like he was really trying to emphasize that, yes,

668
00:42:28.440 --> 00:42:30.800
this did happen to a group of Mexican youth, but

669
00:42:30.840 --> 00:42:34.440
this could happen to anyone if democracy perished against fascism.

670
00:42:34.920 --> 00:42:38.000
But man, is he so right? I feel like those

671
00:42:38.039 --> 00:42:41.360
words are so true, like, first of all, always but

672
00:42:42.079 --> 00:42:44.559
especially now. But you know, the sad part is that

673
00:42:44.559 --> 00:42:48.920
they've always been true, And so I just said, but yes,

674
00:42:49.079 --> 00:42:52.760
like you're green, You're yes. I mean what I said, yes, yes,

675
00:42:53.880 --> 00:42:57.000
which what I wrote like this is a good argument

676
00:42:57.039 --> 00:42:59.480
for the general public. But me looking at it now,

677
00:42:59.599 --> 00:43:03.039
I'm like, this did happen to these groups of Mexican youth,

678
00:43:03.079 --> 00:43:05.079
and it would continue to happen again and again and

679
00:43:05.119 --> 00:43:08.320
again to oppress groups like black Mexican And no, it

680
00:43:08.440 --> 00:43:12.960
truly reminded me of the Park five. Yeah, it really is.

681
00:43:13.000 --> 00:43:19.519
It's it's only who Trump had so much to do

682
00:43:19.639 --> 00:43:23.159
with that. Trump was like chief clean Peoples in this

683
00:43:23.639 --> 00:43:26.360
he has the chief clean peopils of that trial. Yeah,

684
00:43:26.440 --> 00:43:29.239
but I mean, like literally because Chief Clem Pupils was

685
00:43:29.519 --> 00:43:32.519
working with Sensation magazine. No, he put out a whole

686
00:43:32.559 --> 00:43:35.199
ad to call for the Yeah, I don't know if

687
00:43:35.199 --> 00:43:38.119
he called for their debts or just a whole board

688
00:43:38.199 --> 00:43:40.760
like calling for them. Yeah, I was in a billboard.

689
00:43:40.800 --> 00:43:42.159
I thought it was like an ad in the newspaper,

690
00:43:42.199 --> 00:43:43.880
like a full page. Oh, maybe it was an ad.

691
00:43:43.960 --> 00:43:45.000
It was I think it was an ad. I don't

692
00:43:45.000 --> 00:43:49.639
remember something either way. Something, But yeah, there's a lot

693
00:43:49.679 --> 00:43:52.920
of similarities here for sure. But yeah, to me, this

694
00:43:53.079 --> 00:43:55.679
is like these aren't because you know, he wrote as

695
00:43:55.679 --> 00:43:58.079
a warning, like hey, if you don't care about this, now,

696
00:43:58.239 --> 00:44:01.239
it's going to be you next. But it's like why

697
00:44:01.239 --> 00:44:05.159
didn't they care? Anyway, that's too much to ask. No,

698
00:44:05.400 --> 00:44:10.800
it is of people who view us as disposable people.

699
00:44:11.320 --> 00:44:14.119
You're right, even now, how many people don't care about

700
00:44:14.119 --> 00:44:17.400
what's going on with Ice mind truth has been happening,

701
00:44:17.440 --> 00:44:21.559
but now at a truch more obvious visible skill. I

702
00:44:21.639 --> 00:44:23.800
think I've said this in another episode, but the most

703
00:44:23.800 --> 00:44:26.960
annoying fucking comment that I saw once was like, yeah,

704
00:44:27.039 --> 00:44:30.239
it was the gays and the trans people and now

705
00:44:30.239 --> 00:44:32.280
they're coming for the immigrants, and it's like, bitch, they've

706
00:44:32.280 --> 00:44:36.400
always been coming. Imagine being a trance immigrant but no, yeah,

707
00:44:36.559 --> 00:44:42.039
and likewise they've always come for all oppressive oppressed groups, right,

708
00:44:42.199 --> 00:44:45.639
like yeah, to the point where people didn't come out

709
00:44:45.679 --> 00:44:49.000
as trance because of the vitrio. And you know what

710
00:44:49.039 --> 00:44:51.599
I learned about recently, the ugly laws. They were even

711
00:44:51.639 --> 00:44:55.840
coming shit like people that had physical visible disabilities they

712
00:44:55.880 --> 00:44:59.760
were not allow say in public. Yeah, remember the year,

713
00:44:59.840 --> 00:45:02.960
but but too recent for a comfort. I was gonna

714
00:45:02.960 --> 00:45:06.639
say probably around Eugenics, the hardcore eugenics time period, it

715
00:45:06.679 --> 00:45:11.559
would be my guess, or after, yeah, because I remember

716
00:45:11.599 --> 00:45:15.239
looking at the year and when it was finally uh,

717
00:45:15.480 --> 00:45:18.360
that law was no longer in effect in San Francisco specifically,

718
00:45:18.360 --> 00:45:19.840
I from remembering right the video that I saw. I

719
00:45:19.920 --> 00:45:22.920
remember the year, but I was shocked at how recent,

720
00:45:23.000 --> 00:45:32.760
like maybe the sixties if I remembering, Yeah, Oh my god. Anyway,

721
00:45:32.840 --> 00:45:36.280
my point in all this is that, well, this was

722
00:45:36.280 --> 00:45:39.559
a warning. This warning serve to like regular people who

723
00:45:39.559 --> 00:45:44.760
know one heated had heated like them. Office had to

724
00:45:44.800 --> 00:45:51.320
take head stop hed the warning. This was already happening too, right,

725
00:45:51.519 --> 00:45:54.079
and what continued to happen to marginalized groups anyway, Right,

726
00:45:54.079 --> 00:45:57.360
And that's what I'm saying. No, no one heated head style.

727
00:45:57.440 --> 00:46:00.400
I was trying to avoid this again, I'm sorry I

728
00:46:00.480 --> 00:46:07.199
said that like five time heat of Anyway, this book

729
00:46:07.239 --> 00:46:10.760
helped the boys understand that there were larger forces working

730
00:46:10.800 --> 00:46:15.679
against them, and they learned to articulate racism. Yes, exactly,

731
00:46:15.679 --> 00:46:19.119
they learned to I laugh because I'm crying inside. No. Yeah,

732
00:46:19.440 --> 00:46:22.239
they learned to articulate patterns of discrimination that they had

733
00:46:22.320 --> 00:46:25.199
already endured. And what this played in their trial, like

734
00:46:25.239 --> 00:46:29.119
what role is played in their trial? Right? But more importantly,

735
00:46:29.119 --> 00:46:32.840
it's not them. They were not alone. Even the Saint

736
00:46:33.159 --> 00:46:36.360
Quentin prison ward read the pamphlet and was on their side.

737
00:46:37.199 --> 00:46:41.360
Now that's wild. Now that's crazy. Now you're talking crazy

738
00:46:42.800 --> 00:46:44.719
or okay, he was sympathetic to their cause, which I

739
00:46:44.719 --> 00:46:48.599
think is basically being on their side. I mean, yeah,

740
00:46:48.599 --> 00:46:53.280
I think Henry wrote to Alice after reading this quote,

741
00:46:53.320 --> 00:46:56.760
I had lost all faith before, and now there's plenty

742
00:46:56.800 --> 00:46:59.519
of nice people that are really trying their best to

743
00:46:59.599 --> 00:47:02.239
see us get a fair trial. And that's really all

744
00:47:02.280 --> 00:47:04.519
I asked to get a fair trial. And this was

745
00:47:04.519 --> 00:47:06.360
good for the boys, but sadly because a lot of

746
00:47:06.400 --> 00:47:09.039
their work focused on the boys, the girls of Sleepy Lagoon,

747
00:47:09.119 --> 00:47:13.639
they're largely forgotten. On top of them, like being largely

748
00:47:13.639 --> 00:47:18.280
forgotten by the white public. The SLDC did visit them regularly,

749
00:47:18.320 --> 00:47:20.360
like Alice went and visited them too, but there was

750
00:47:20.360 --> 00:47:22.880
no legal recourse to help them because there was This

751
00:47:23.000 --> 00:47:27.119
wasn't the regular criminal justice system. It was just a

752
00:47:27.199 --> 00:47:29.119
school they were sent to, but they had to go

753
00:47:29.480 --> 00:47:33.320
or they would be subject to actual criminal the criminal

754
00:47:33.440 --> 00:47:38.840
justice system, which is still institutionalization exactly. On top of that,

755
00:47:38.880 --> 00:47:41.639
many of the parents of the girls thought that the school,

756
00:47:41.719 --> 00:47:44.480
the Venture School, and the girls being wards of the state,

757
00:47:44.519 --> 00:47:46.599
would be good for them to get them off the streets,

758
00:47:47.400 --> 00:47:50.440
so they supported them being in the school. So there

759
00:47:50.519 --> 00:47:52.920
was like nothing to do for them. And then those

760
00:47:52.960 --> 00:47:55.840
that maybe occasionally thought about like oh yeah there was

761
00:47:55.920 --> 00:47:59.360
Mexican girls involved in this basically were like, oh, well,

762
00:47:59.400 --> 00:48:01.880
they got what they did or for like hanging out

763
00:48:01.920 --> 00:48:04.960
with the wrong type of people, So yeah, there was

764
00:48:05.000 --> 00:48:08.519
not much they could do for them. And while the

765
00:48:08.719 --> 00:48:12.199
SLDC leadership and volunteers kept doing what they could, many

766
00:48:12.360 --> 00:48:14.880
friends and many of the friends and family of the

767
00:48:14.920 --> 00:48:17.920
boys they had no choice but to step back. Like

768
00:48:18.000 --> 00:48:20.280
life caught up with them and they just couldn't be

769
00:48:20.400 --> 00:48:23.440
involved in like activism anymore. Like in the case of

770
00:48:23.519 --> 00:48:27.719
Delia Parra, who was the wife of Ismael Parra, she

771
00:48:27.800 --> 00:48:30.639
wrote to Alice in September nineteen forty four that she

772
00:48:30.719 --> 00:48:32.719
was sorry for not having been able to continue her

773
00:48:32.760 --> 00:48:35.760
volunteer work and not checking in, but her mom had

774
00:48:35.840 --> 00:48:37.760
been hospitalized for two weeks, and on top of that,

775
00:48:37.840 --> 00:48:41.920
she had been evicted from their apartment, and she was

776
00:48:41.960 --> 00:48:45.280
also very worried about hurting her husband's feelings because she

777
00:48:45.280 --> 00:48:47.760
could only afford to get to Saint Quentin once a

778
00:48:47.800 --> 00:48:51.480
month to see them with their daughter. And that's the

779
00:48:51.559 --> 00:48:54.280
thing that like so many people were, you know, working

780
00:48:55.199 --> 00:48:58.480
and raising funds for the legal team of the defendants.

781
00:49:00.079 --> 00:49:03.360
Side of that, like their families were still like struggling

782
00:49:04.000 --> 00:49:08.519
subject to life in la you know, And so she

783
00:49:08.880 --> 00:49:10.760
and a lot of the families had to step back.

784
00:49:10.880 --> 00:49:12.559
Some of them, you know, continue to work in this,

785
00:49:12.760 --> 00:49:15.679
but yeah, they did what they could. And despite the

786
00:49:15.719 --> 00:49:19.840
families having to step back, or like her, she stepped back,

787
00:49:20.039 --> 00:49:24.559
the SLDC was gaining momentum. They were getting letters from

788
00:49:24.559 --> 00:49:28.320
Black soldiers stationed overseas stating, quote, we members of the

789
00:49:28.360 --> 00:49:31.239
colored race, or sympathetic to your worthwhile and moral fight

790
00:49:31.320 --> 00:49:34.920
to free the Mexican boys. End quote That reminds me.

791
00:49:35.079 --> 00:49:37.760
I didn't mention it when we did the Border Patrol episodes,

792
00:49:37.800 --> 00:49:42.000
but there was someone who wrote to the president. I

793
00:49:42.000 --> 00:49:45.360
don't remember if it was Carter at the time or

794
00:49:45.400 --> 00:49:49.440
someone else, but a black man who was watching the

795
00:49:49.519 --> 00:49:52.639
news or Border Patrol or something, and he lived like

796
00:49:52.679 --> 00:49:55.880
in a border town community and he wrote letters expressing

797
00:49:56.000 --> 00:49:59.920
like discontent and like oh, like they're harming the mex

798
00:50:00.039 --> 00:50:03.159
Skins basically and blah blah, oh my god, I didn't

799
00:50:03.199 --> 00:50:08.199
know that. And you were like, this country is a

800
00:50:08.320 --> 00:50:12.119
very like what's the word I'm looking for? Like puts

801
00:50:12.119 --> 00:50:18.679
the military above like m yeah, everything realizes, idolizes, pedestalizes.

802
00:50:19.360 --> 00:50:20.639
It's not a word, but you know what I mean.

803
00:50:20.840 --> 00:50:24.639
That's the military and members of the metalary military and

804
00:50:24.639 --> 00:50:29.440
a pedestal Yeah, so if if, why not use that

805
00:50:29.519 --> 00:50:32.719
to your advantage to get people to sway their minds

806
00:50:32.719 --> 00:50:36.000
into supporting the cause, like and of course these black

807
00:50:36.039 --> 00:50:39.119
soldiers were going to be behind this cost too, because

808
00:50:39.119 --> 00:50:43.400
this is something they experienced too. Yeah, exactation mm hmm.

809
00:50:44.159 --> 00:50:47.079
And the they also had this a part of Hollywood

810
00:50:47.119 --> 00:50:51.400
stars like Rita Hayworth, Orson Wells, Canada, Lee, Anthony Quinn,

811
00:50:51.840 --> 00:50:56.000
Vincent Price, Gene Kelly, Lena Horn, and Nat King Cole.

812
00:50:56.599 --> 00:50:59.320
Of those, I only know Jene Kelly and that King Cole. Oh,

813
00:50:59.519 --> 00:51:03.280
that's say that King Cole. Some of the names sounded familiar, Okay.

814
00:51:03.800 --> 00:51:06.360
Rita Hayworth sounds very familiar, and so does Orson Welles.

815
00:51:07.199 --> 00:51:10.320
They also had lawyer Ben Margoliz take the lead in

816
00:51:10.360 --> 00:51:14.960
the appeal process because George Shubley had been subject to

817
00:51:14.960 --> 00:51:17.639
the draft. He was drafted in World War Two. Wait,

818
00:51:17.719 --> 00:51:20.719
how old was he? I don't know. I guess old

819
00:51:20.840 --> 00:51:24.480
enough to be drafted. Yeah, I mean young enough to

820
00:51:24.519 --> 00:51:28.280
be drafted. Mm hmm. So yeah, yeah, he was drafted.

821
00:51:28.400 --> 00:51:32.239
And so Ben Margoliz came in and he had a

822
00:51:32.239 --> 00:51:35.920
again another long record of taking difficult, unpopular progressive cases

823
00:51:35.920 --> 00:51:40.239
and winning them, and so he was very much down

824
00:51:40.280 --> 00:51:44.000
for the cause when he heard like you know about

825
00:51:44.000 --> 00:51:46.800
it and taking the Sleepy Lagoon case would end up

826
00:51:46.800 --> 00:51:49.320
costing him five thousand of his own money. Five thousand

827
00:51:49.360 --> 00:51:51.559
dollars of his own money. Okay, so this didn't go

828
00:51:51.599 --> 00:51:55.920
well then, no, no, no, eh, do you not know

829
00:51:56.159 --> 00:52:03.360
how people VI Samora ends. No, obviously, I said, let

830
00:52:03.440 --> 00:52:09.119
me continue. I thought everybody knew about people Visamora. My bad,

831
00:52:09.400 --> 00:52:15.239
all right, meaning he he did this for solo costs

832
00:52:15.239 --> 00:52:18.800
that he lost lost money. Okay, Well, I'm sorry, I'm dumb. Okay,

833
00:52:19.000 --> 00:52:22.639
I feel like you forget that, and I forget because

834
00:52:22.639 --> 00:52:25.880
I'm dumb too, Okay, go on. He and the team

835
00:52:26.000 --> 00:52:30.320
went through six thousand pages of transcripts and like the

836
00:52:30.360 --> 00:52:34.079
trial and found a consistent pattern of bias. Of course,

837
00:52:36.280 --> 00:52:40.119
that Judge Frick had denied the defendants their constitutional right

838
00:52:40.239 --> 00:52:44.079
to consult their lawyers, and that the evidence did not

839
00:52:44.199 --> 00:52:47.320
support the charges of conspiracy and murder, and yet the

840
00:52:47.400 --> 00:52:50.880
jury had found them guilty. And so while the legal

841
00:52:50.920 --> 00:52:53.679
team worked the case, Alice worked with the boys so

842
00:52:53.719 --> 00:52:56.079
that they would not get into further trouble in prison,

843
00:52:56.280 --> 00:52:59.920
so that they could keep a good image, because how

844
00:53:00.000 --> 00:53:03.760
ivan them having an incident in prison could end the

845
00:53:03.800 --> 00:53:06.679
whole appeal process. M They could just be like, no,

846
00:53:06.760 --> 00:53:10.960
you're not eligible too, And that's so wild, because yeah,

847
00:53:11.280 --> 00:53:13.440
like prison cars could just make shit up as they

848
00:53:13.480 --> 00:53:16.440
do often, someone else could attack them. They could get

849
00:53:16.440 --> 00:53:20.719
in trouble for that. Yeah, but luckily she didn't have

850
00:53:20.760 --> 00:53:23.480
to do much because although the rest of the world

851
00:53:23.559 --> 00:53:27.199
saw them as hardened gangsters, they were all very much

852
00:53:27.239 --> 00:53:30.360
out of place in prison. Again, most of them had

853
00:53:30.360 --> 00:53:34.719
no criminal records before Sleepy Lagoon. They attended mass they

854
00:53:35.360 --> 00:53:38.320
enrolled in school when they were allowed to. They volunteered

855
00:53:38.320 --> 00:53:41.920
for war work. They joined prison sports programs and then

856
00:53:42.000 --> 00:53:46.079
excelled in baseball and boxing. So they were staying out

857
00:53:46.079 --> 00:53:48.239
of trouble big time. The only one who had a

858
00:53:48.440 --> 00:53:52.559
very very hard time was Henry Lebas, who was already

859
00:53:52.559 --> 00:53:56.599
so stubborn, strong headed, prideful. You put someone like that

860
00:53:57.039 --> 00:53:59.079
and you don't you never know what's going to happen,

861
00:53:59.199 --> 00:54:01.800
you know. He just didn't take shit from no one

862
00:54:01.840 --> 00:54:04.079
like he wasn't want to stand down, So if anyone

863
00:54:04.119 --> 00:54:06.679
started anything with him, he was going to fight back,

864
00:54:07.199 --> 00:54:09.760
while someone else might have been like, no, I'm trying

865
00:54:09.800 --> 00:54:13.920
to be good, it's not worth it whatever. Yeah, he

866
00:54:14.079 --> 00:54:16.320
was not like that, and so he ended up being

867
00:54:16.320 --> 00:54:22.559
transferred to fulsome a higher security prison. At least his transgressions,

868
00:54:22.599 --> 00:54:24.960
if you will, didn't get them into trouble, and they

869
00:54:25.159 --> 00:54:28.440
continued the appeal process. The key is getting in trouble

870
00:54:28.440 --> 00:54:32.519
didn't affect that. Finally, in May of nineteen forty four,

871
00:54:32.639 --> 00:54:35.320
Ben Margoliz was able to argue the case in front

872
00:54:35.320 --> 00:54:37.760
of a panel of judges, and of course he did

873
00:54:37.760 --> 00:54:42.039
an amazing job. His clothing thoughts, I will show them. Quote.

874
00:54:42.559 --> 00:54:44.880
It was not just the boys who were on trial.

875
00:54:45.320 --> 00:54:52.159
The Mexican people were tried. Neither is guilty end quote. Yeah,

876
00:54:52.400 --> 00:54:55.840
it was very much true. Yeah, as you could see

877
00:54:55.880 --> 00:54:58.559
from their statements saying things like, oh, well they're Mexican,

878
00:54:58.599 --> 00:55:01.079
they can't help their violence because it's a lot of blood.

879
00:55:01.920 --> 00:55:04.719
And it wasn't until October of nineteen forty four when

880
00:55:04.719 --> 00:55:08.400
the judges announced their decision. They agreed that the state

881
00:55:08.519 --> 00:55:11.559
lacked sufficient evidence to convict the young men of conspiracy

882
00:55:11.639 --> 00:55:14.960
or murder. And they did m hmm. But they did

883
00:55:15.000 --> 00:55:17.719
not agree that race played a role in the original ruling.

884
00:55:18.280 --> 00:55:21.760
Wrong but okay, but either way, there were twenty eight

885
00:55:21.880 --> 00:55:25.920
nineteen forty four, the Court of Appeals reversed all twelve convictions.

886
00:55:26.440 --> 00:55:31.719
It was a victory. Wow, yeah, yeah, all twelve are

887
00:55:31.480 --> 00:55:37.440
were released. Amazing but sadly, sadly, the time that they

888
00:55:37.440 --> 00:55:41.199
had already spent in prison, it was irreparable. Like, yeah,

889
00:55:41.440 --> 00:55:44.440
this song reminds me of and I know they don't

890
00:55:44.480 --> 00:55:46.159
like going by the Central Park five. I just don't

891
00:55:46.199 --> 00:55:50.159
have brother, they don't, Yeah, but just recognizable to everybody

892
00:55:50.199 --> 00:55:52.440
that term. But it reminds me of them, like they

893
00:55:52.440 --> 00:55:58.280
were young teamed one of them was a young adult. Yeah,

894
00:55:58.360 --> 00:56:01.239
and they were grown, grown men. And I remember I

895
00:56:02.599 --> 00:56:04.159
want to chear up now just thinking about all the

896
00:56:04.199 --> 00:56:07.960
time they lost. No matter what, you can't get that back, Like, no,

897
00:56:08.079 --> 00:56:10.480
you can't get that back. But also you're put in

898
00:56:10.519 --> 00:56:14.960
a place it's scary, traumatic as place. Yeah, okay, and

899
00:56:15.039 --> 00:56:19.920
so yeah, that time was irreparable, and so on the

900
00:56:19.960 --> 00:56:22.519
news of their release, like hearing that one prison guard

901
00:56:22.559 --> 00:56:25.639
at Saint Quentin smirked and said they'll be back. Wow,

902
00:56:26.159 --> 00:56:28.360
and like fucking for saying that, But it was true,

903
00:56:28.400 --> 00:56:30.880
because like this is what the prison system does in

904
00:56:30.920 --> 00:56:34.400
this country most of the time. Yeah, And so Henry

905
00:56:34.519 --> 00:56:37.800
leave as Chepa Ruiz and car Padilla and Manny Delgado,

906
00:56:38.119 --> 00:56:42.159
they would all return enof to prison in their lifetime.

907
00:56:42.840 --> 00:56:45.559
Manny Delgado was the only one able to escape the cycle.

908
00:56:45.679 --> 00:56:48.480
After his second incarceration, he settled down with his wife

909
00:56:48.519 --> 00:56:51.480
and he was never arrested again. But the rest of

910
00:56:51.480 --> 00:56:53.400
them were in and out of jail their whole lives.

911
00:56:54.199 --> 00:56:57.639
Gus Samura, who this trial is named after, like the

912
00:56:58.119 --> 00:57:00.760
person who was doing the transcripts just picked the random name,

913
00:57:00.840 --> 00:57:03.199
misspelled his name. It has two ms, but when you

914
00:57:03.199 --> 00:57:06.679
look at the people versus Samora, it's a one M.

915
00:57:06.760 --> 00:57:10.199
But his last name has two ms. Oh yeah. But

916
00:57:10.280 --> 00:57:13.440
the namesake of this case, he met a similar fate

917
00:57:13.480 --> 00:57:16.960
in and out of prison. He unfortunately wasn't stranged with

918
00:57:17.079 --> 00:57:20.199
his family because his father was unable to forgive him

919
00:57:20.239 --> 00:57:22.880
for the embarrassment he put them through, and being a

920
00:57:22.920 --> 00:57:24.840
patriarch in the family, they all listened to him, and

921
00:57:24.880 --> 00:57:27.840
he became strange with all of them, which I'm assuming

922
00:57:27.960 --> 00:57:31.480
makes the process of trying to reintegrate into society much harder,

923
00:57:31.679 --> 00:57:36.280
even harder without the support. Yah, But some of them,

924
00:57:36.320 --> 00:57:38.599
some of them ended up being able to turn their

925
00:57:38.639 --> 00:57:42.880
lives around. Many Reyes, John Matthous and Jack Melendez became

926
00:57:43.000 --> 00:57:47.719
entrepreneurs in the LA area and the SOLDC disbanded in

927
00:57:47.800 --> 00:57:51.119
nineteen forty five, and many of them were facing trials

928
00:57:51.199 --> 00:57:55.280
during the name McCarthy's amera oh. Members of the of

929
00:57:55.320 --> 00:57:58.159
the Sleepy Lagoon Defense Committee, the activists who stood up

930
00:57:58.199 --> 00:58:01.599
for these young Mexican men were then brought to trial

931
00:58:01.719 --> 00:58:04.800
during the Mark MacCarthys ara. Of course, of course, of

932
00:58:04.840 --> 00:58:07.840
course they were Yeah, they were accused of inspiring the

933
00:58:07.920 --> 00:58:10.599
Zutsu Riots as part of a master plot to disrupt

934
00:58:10.679 --> 00:58:15.000
American society. Oh my god, that's ridiculous. Yeah, because that's

935
00:58:15.000 --> 00:58:16.920
going to be our next episode of the Zuzu Riots.

936
00:58:16.920 --> 00:58:20.440
But the Zuzu Riots occurred between the ending of the

937
00:58:20.480 --> 00:58:23.800
trial and the appeal. The appeal was in nineteen forty four.

938
00:58:24.119 --> 00:58:26.800
The trial began nineteen forty two and nineteen forty three.

939
00:58:27.000 --> 00:58:28.119
I want to say it was the year of the

940
00:58:28.199 --> 00:58:31.960
Zuzi Riots. And between this time period though, because five

941
00:58:32.000 --> 00:58:35.360
months after the guilty veriic was announced is when the

942
00:58:35.440 --> 00:58:38.559
trial are not the trial the Zuzu Riots happened, because

943
00:58:38.599 --> 00:58:43.559
that only weren't racial tensions that were already in place. Yeah,

944
00:58:43.599 --> 00:58:46.639
and many, despite you know, being brought to trial during

945
00:58:46.639 --> 00:58:49.840
the McCarthyism era, many of them continued to work in

946
00:58:49.880 --> 00:58:53.239
activism and a lot of people, a lot of scholars

947
00:58:53.559 --> 00:58:57.559
today consider People Versus Samora as a landmark of progress

948
00:58:57.599 --> 00:59:00.400
for Spanish speakers in the US and the beginning of

949
00:59:00.440 --> 00:59:08.679
the Chicano movement. And as for Joseliyaz his family, they

950
00:59:08.960 --> 00:59:15.239
never recovered. Diao says father. He used to entertain his

951
00:59:15.239 --> 00:59:18.960
family playing the violin for everyone, and after Josseliyaz's death,

952
00:59:19.079 --> 00:59:22.840
he never played again. Oh that's so sad. I know.

953
00:59:23.400 --> 00:59:27.239
His brother Lino Dias named his son after his brother

954
00:59:27.360 --> 00:59:30.960
Jose and Theodulo was never able to hold his grandson.

955
00:59:31.599 --> 00:59:34.719
He just couldn't get himself head. I cry, I know,

956
00:59:34.760 --> 00:59:37.280
and I was gonna say, like just because we're you know,

957
00:59:37.559 --> 00:59:39.840
obviously this is not a fair trial, but that is

958
00:59:39.880 --> 00:59:44.440
a negate, the fact that this family suffered and deserved justice.

959
00:59:44.519 --> 00:59:47.199
But I think it's it was time then, that time

960
00:59:47.280 --> 00:59:49.840
now that people stop looking for the criminal justice system

961
00:59:49.880 --> 00:59:53.960
for justice. Yeah, they and they never really had any closure.

962
00:59:54.079 --> 00:59:57.960
The case remained unsolved. They never learned what actually happened

963
00:59:57.960 --> 01:00:01.440
to their son brother. And in truth that the three

964
01:00:01.519 --> 01:00:05.159
eighth Street Boys, this youth gang supposed a gang, they

965
01:00:05.199 --> 01:00:07.519
simply could not have done it. They all went from

966
01:00:07.559 --> 01:00:10.679
the car straight to the home. They fought for a

967
01:00:10.679 --> 01:00:14.079
few minutes and they ran away. One of them on

968
01:00:14.119 --> 01:00:18.000
the way back to the car, like did see Jose

969
01:00:18.199 --> 01:00:20.079
Yas on the floor and like hit them with a

970
01:00:20.119 --> 01:00:23.800
bat twice, but that was not at all the cause

971
01:00:23.800 --> 01:00:25.880
of death. He like hit them in the legs and

972
01:00:25.920 --> 01:00:28.239
then they continued to run. It's like, oh, someone else

973
01:00:28.280 --> 01:00:30.639
to hey, because they're already in this like fighting mode,

974
01:00:30.840 --> 01:00:33.079
but continued to run like. There's absolutely no way that

975
01:00:33.119 --> 01:00:35.119
it was him who did it, because yeah, they were

976
01:00:35.360 --> 01:00:38.559
in and out so fast. And so there's two possibilities

977
01:00:38.599 --> 01:00:42.239
of what actually happened. In the PBS series The American Experience,

978
01:00:42.320 --> 01:00:47.199
The Zutsuit Riot Lorena Lorena and Sinas's son, Ted Encinas

979
01:00:47.599 --> 01:00:50.119
said that his mom carried a heavy burden for her

980
01:00:50.119 --> 01:00:53.480
whole life, and on her deathbed she couldn't hold it anymore.

981
01:00:53.679 --> 01:00:57.079
She told Ted that her brother Louis nc Nas told

982
01:00:57.119 --> 01:01:01.119
her he had killed Jose. Yes, his uncle Louis had

983
01:01:01.159 --> 01:01:04.639
been part of the young men from the Downy remember them,

984
01:01:04.679 --> 01:01:07.480
the Downy Boys. Yeah, he had been part of the

985
01:01:07.519 --> 01:01:10.440
Downy boys who went to the party, and that on

986
01:01:10.480 --> 01:01:13.159
their way out they had jumped Hose the ass so

987
01:01:13.280 --> 01:01:15.840
with them. But the problem is that this doesn't add

988
01:01:15.920 --> 01:01:21.920
up with the time of anything, because the Downy Boys

989
01:01:22.239 --> 01:01:25.360
they all left around eleven thirty and their only stop

990
01:01:25.519 --> 01:01:31.079
from there to anywhere was the Sleepy actual Sleepy Lagoon

991
01:01:31.800 --> 01:01:34.280
shortly after leaving at eleven thirty, where they fought with

992
01:01:34.719 --> 01:01:37.800
this thirty eighth Street group, right, and Joselias was still

993
01:01:37.800 --> 01:01:39.840
at the party. He left the party around twelve forty,

994
01:01:40.519 --> 01:01:42.920
so it physically couldn't have been him either, even though

995
01:01:42.920 --> 01:01:45.440
he thought it was him and he carried that gill,

996
01:01:45.519 --> 01:01:50.000
as well as then passing that gilt onto his sister

997
01:01:50.079 --> 01:01:52.119
by telling her like it was me, but it wasn't him.

998
01:01:52.280 --> 01:01:55.320
It couldn't happen him because they never returned to the

999
01:01:55.400 --> 01:01:59.960
de La home after having fought the thirty eighth Street

1000
01:02:00.119 --> 01:02:04.000
group at the Sleepy Lagoon. The other possibility is that

1001
01:02:04.079 --> 01:02:06.679
Jose was killed by the two young men who left

1002
01:02:06.679 --> 01:02:09.559
the party with him. Who knew he was carrying money,

1003
01:02:09.599 --> 01:02:12.400
who knew he was about to leave for the army?

1004
01:02:13.239 --> 01:02:16.159
And who were those people to do the names? Yeah,

1005
01:02:16.199 --> 01:02:20.320
and this was Luis Sito Vardas and Andrew Torres. Were

1006
01:02:20.320 --> 01:02:23.400
they part of the group that was tried, No, they

1007
01:02:23.440 --> 01:02:27.159
were never questioned. The police was busy nab zoot suitors.

1008
01:02:27.679 --> 01:02:30.800
Oh my god. And you know what, more often than not,

1009
01:02:31.079 --> 01:02:33.639
and this is the most likely, these were the most

1010
01:02:33.679 --> 01:02:36.280
likely people who killed him. Most people are harmed and

1011
01:02:36.360 --> 01:02:41.239
killed by people they know. Yeah, and his money was gone,

1012
01:02:41.599 --> 01:02:45.360
so there's the motive. I can't believe there was this

1013
01:02:45.679 --> 01:02:48.199
complete misstep. Of course they weren't able to find I mean,

1014
01:02:48.239 --> 01:02:50.239
I can't believe it. But of course they weren't able

1015
01:02:50.239 --> 01:02:52.679
to find a motive beforehand because there was none. Because

1016
01:02:52.679 --> 01:02:56.400
this makes more sense. Yeah, and these two were never

1017
01:02:56.440 --> 01:02:59.519
brought in, nothing done. But he left the party with

1018
01:02:59.599 --> 01:03:02.679
them at around twelve forty. Yeah, so they were last

1019
01:03:02.719 --> 01:03:06.679
ones to see him. But yeah, that was the Sleepy

1020
01:03:06.719 --> 01:03:09.559
Lagoon case. Sorry, if I sat her out of breath

1021
01:03:09.559 --> 01:03:13.039
the whole time I am out of breath, I didn't notice. Okay,

1022
01:03:13.079 --> 01:03:16.000
I feel out of breath. So oh, I was gonna say,

1023
01:03:16.079 --> 01:03:19.039
before you give any final thoughts or anything that I

1024
01:03:19.119 --> 01:03:22.480
have listened to like two or three other existing episodes

1025
01:03:22.519 --> 01:03:26.000
on Sleepy the Sleepy Lagoon case. Sometimes it's combined with

1026
01:03:26.039 --> 01:03:29.599
Sleepy Lagoon and Zuo Suit Riot together in one episode,

1027
01:03:29.880 --> 01:03:31.880
but none of them really talked about HO said, yeah,

1028
01:03:31.880 --> 01:03:34.559
it's like in the end, like what So I wanted

1029
01:03:34.599 --> 01:03:36.639
to make sure I could find that and include that

1030
01:03:36.719 --> 01:03:39.199
here so we could get just like a full like

1031
01:03:39.599 --> 01:03:42.400
in the end, this was never solved. His family never

1032
01:03:42.599 --> 01:03:46.199
had closure and they too suffered a bunch you know, everyone,

1033
01:03:46.360 --> 01:03:50.440
like everyone lost basically the few that you know ended

1034
01:03:50.519 --> 01:03:53.480
up being able to turn their lives around. But yeah,

1035
01:03:53.639 --> 01:03:59.840
it's just the criminal justice system and the racial biases. Yeah,

1036
01:04:00.159 --> 01:04:02.719
we're very much real and all of this is going

1037
01:04:02.800 --> 01:04:06.360
to is informed. What would happen in between, you know,

1038
01:04:06.400 --> 01:04:10.159
the appeal and the trial which was the Zuzu riots,

1039
01:04:10.159 --> 01:04:13.800
which is going to be next episode. Thanks for listening, everybody,

1040
01:04:13.880 --> 01:04:16.920
and we hope this was one less Estadia Unknown for you.

1041
01:04:17.760 --> 01:04:24.320
Bye bye. Estoria's Unknown is produced by Carmen and Christina,

1042
01:04:24.440 --> 01:04:27.679
researched by Carmen and Christina, edited by Christina. You can

1043
01:04:27.719 --> 01:04:30.679
find sources for every episode at Estoria's Unknown dot com

1044
01:04:30.719 --> 01:04:33.280
and in our show notes. Creating the podcast has a

1045
01:04:33.320 --> 01:04:34.559
lot of work, so if you want to help us

1046
01:04:34.559 --> 01:04:37.559
out financially, you can do so by supporting us on

1047
01:04:37.679 --> 01:04:40.639
Patreon at patreon dot com. Slash You Studied as an

1048
01:04:40.639 --> 01:04:41.239
own podcast