Oct. 23, 2025

History of Border Patrol (Part 4)

History of Border Patrol (Part 4)
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The organization known today as border patrol began in 1924. In this episode, Carmen gets into changes in the border patrol, a bit more about the Mexican government collaborating with US border patrol, the bracero program and changes that led to more migrant deaths

Come see Carmen & Cristina Nov 1st, 2025 in Yakima,WA:  The Cucuy Is Going to Get You Nov 1st, 2025 event in Yakima, WA

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Sources

https://aapihistorymuseum.org/what-did-these-anti-chinese-laws-and-rules-say/ 
Migra! A History of US Border Patrol by Kelly Lytte Hernandez
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Milton 
https://read.dukeupress.edu/hahr/article/50/3/602/152626/The-Spanish-Americans-of-New-Mexico-A-Heritage-of 
https://sourcenm.com/2024/09/24/what-does-hispanic-identity-mean-in-new-mexico/

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WEBVTT

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Hi everyone.

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This is Carmen and Christina and this is Estodias, known

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a podcast where we talk about Latin American history. Sometimes

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it's horrible and deals with tivy topics like criticism, corruption,

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and genocide. But more than that, it's supposed about resistance,

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power and community. We're continuing our history of La Pinta

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Migra the Border Patrol. Yes, so yeah, what so far

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we've talked about a lot. This is part four and

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we talked about the origins the border patrol after the

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US passed the series of anti immigrants and racist loss.

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Essentially the men who made up the early Border Patrol,

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the racism, their violence, their lies and methology, their first

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attempt at reformation, which only happened a few years after

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they began, right and held, the targeting of Mexicans by

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the Border Patrol, how the Mexican government dealt with Mexican immigration,

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and then last time we talked about how the border

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patrol developed in California, which was a little different than

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Texas but still racist. So yeah, today we're going to

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get into some changes in the border patrol, a little

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bit about how the Mexican government collaborated with the Border patrol,

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including the Arcado program, and I think that's basically going.

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To cover it.

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So during World War Two, the Border Patrol expanded their work.

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Along with patrolling, the border officers were reassigned to guard

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against enemy submarines and the golf of Mexico. They also

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were reassigned to transport Japanese Americans and Japanese immigrants to

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internment camps, and they worked as guards at the internment camps.

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I didn't know that. I didn't know this, but I'm

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really surprised about this. But I'm like, someone had to

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do the job, and who else? Who else perfect?

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Who would be?

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There's no one more perfect for this shitty ass job

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in border patrol. To round up people like this is

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what they love to do. So yeah, of course they

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did it.

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Yeah, I just I feel like I don't.

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First of all, as soon as I write this, I'm

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been telling everybody, I'm like, guess what, guess who did

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you know? Yeah, And everyone's like, oh oh wow, But

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no one's surprised. No one's privybe they weren't. Okay, well,

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the white people have told them.

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It's surprise.

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I well, I'm not surprised about that, but I forgot

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where the rest of my tried thought was going, so

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I'll just move on, okay. They also interrogated German and

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Italian immigrants about their sympathies for Hitler and fascism. Some

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would say that was anti fascist of them. Oh my god,

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it's Border Patrol Antifa. These are the actually uh founders

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of Antifa. Border Patrol was once Antifa and look at

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them now? How the mighty have fallen? The Border Patrol

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budget and staff grew during World War Two, and it

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also brought the Border Patrol into a federal operating level

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that they were not at before.

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Does that make sense?

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So basically they were working with federal agencies in a

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way they weren't before, like with the FBI and others. Yes, yeah, yeah,

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And during this gross I mean, you would think they

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had so many other things to focus on, like World

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War two, potential quote subversives, communists right now, You think

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they would focus on those things. But no, no, they

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just continued to focus on Mexicans. I was gonna say,

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is this a time period where they finally leave Mexicans

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alone for a little bit? But no, oh, they never

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They never did that. The only time they did that

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was in the early beginnings of border patrol, when they were.

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Chasing the Chinese.

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Okay, okay, yeah, oh in California, they were focusing more

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on Europeans. Right, surprisingly, right, that was shocking. That actually

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did drop my job a little bit. So the war

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developed in Europe, the US called for strengthening the border,

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and as a result, in nineteen forty, Congress transferred the

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INS and this is the Immigration and Naturalization Service.

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I forgot the name of that. Wow.

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They transferred them from the Department of Labor to the

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Department of Justice. This is where that shift, This is

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where happened. Yeah, they became more like criminalization based than before.

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And Congress also added two hundred thousand dollars and seven

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hundred and twelve officers to the Border Patrol, and this

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only doubled by the following year.

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This transferred to the Border Patrol.

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I always said that, but basically, like I said, on

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the same playing field as the FBI, the Bureau of Prohibition,

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which would later become the DA another demon organization.

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I didn't know that.

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Yeah, So why we have this podcast.

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We learned so much?

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No, but yeah, no, no, yeah no, but yeah, And

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along with this change, the US Attorney General also worked

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to consolidate the border patrol and move away from the

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previous era of regionalization, so a more like top level

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top head, I don't know they call it, but a

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more hierarchical organization with the direct chiev a supervisor for

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all the places, all the regions to answer to, instead

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of each region basically being its own border patrol. They're

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organizing restructuring right right, because we talked about how each

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region basically developed their own way of being border patrol

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and they had no oversight. So now they had, you know,

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someone at the federal level to answer to those actually

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making them answer them to them.

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Okay.

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And technology was also improving during this time, and border

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patrol gained access to radio communityations and planes all to

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better chase down migrants. I thought you were gonna say,

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all the better chase down Mexicans. Yeah, I mean during

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this time. And of course there was always other Latinos

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during this time, but you know, everyone wants skin to them,

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especially they were coming from Mexico, you know.

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Yeah, with this.

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Growth came new recruits who changed things up and were

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not keen to follow the old timers way. Because there

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was war time there was a constant flux of men

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coming in and out due to being called to the

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warm and this caused extreme shortages. And as they had

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done before, the Boarder Patrol lowered their standards even more,

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even more more, if that was possible then they already had.

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Where are they at now, like the fucking floor, like

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this is hell? Or fourth time the bar has to

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be in help by now? Like what the fuck right?

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Like who there's just straight up the generous joy this point,

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like how to throw their Eugenus language back at them.

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These are just feeble minded people who are now working

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for a border patrol and ice. So yeah, they lowered

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the standards even more, and they also shortened the training

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time at the Border Patrols training school.

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Oh my god, in.

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Order to try to hire more officers and retain more

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You know what's crazy. You could take that sentence and

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like saying them seeing.

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Now and it would apply. Yeah, but worse, I mean,

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are they even training now?

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They're probably just giving them guns and being like, okay,

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they're there. They don't know okay, like they don't know

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how to properly restrain people. They're out here, they don't

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know having on the backs of teenage girls choking people.

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They're dropping their weapons right, fumbling and then picking them

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frantically checking on them at crowds. Yeah, so, yeah, I

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don't know what they're doing now. They probably only have

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like one week of training now. Yeah, these new recruits

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were a lot more different. They were different than old timers,

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how namely that most of them were not from the

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border regions though they came from the Midwest, and the

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old timers tried passing on their ways reyelling stories from

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their heyday. In one story in old Thimer talked about

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a time he needed a defense because he killed a

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quote smuggler, right, but they could call anyone a smuggler

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that was there that was part of their defense. And

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this supposed smuggler didn't even have a weapon, and this

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Oldzheimer shot him and killed him. And then he needed

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like a reason, right, So then his fellow officers and

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knew he needed an alibi gun. And by the next morning,

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because it's happened at night, they were looking for the

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gun that the smuggler supposedly had, and they fetched out

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five to six guns out of the river because his

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fellow officers knew that he needed a gun. So that's

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like the kind of stories and traditions they were trying

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to pass on, and these new Midwestern recruits were like, no,

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we're not doing that. Yeah, wow, okay Midwestern recruits right.

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Yeah.

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So, no matter how much the old timers tried to

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force their ways and pass on, you know, their tradition

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of violence, like we have been talking about, the new

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recruits would not outright act violently. Okay, I'm surprised this.

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I I'm surprised that.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, but it gets worse. Oh anytime you think it's

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gonna get better, it's not. No.

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Yeah, I should know that by now. Yeah.

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And there was another instance of a new recruit refraining

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from using excessive force against migrants who resisted arrests and

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old timer Jim conning him. If you don't remember him,

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he was a fellow whose brother Jack indiscriminately shot at

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Mexicans to avenge Jim who had been shot by smugglers.

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Do you remember that story? Oh, and this is just

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a story that they would repeat. Oh yeah, this is

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one of the things, Like so the things, the things

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I have been talking about, like the guy they were

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avenging and they killed like six people to avengin.

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Yeah, this is it.

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Yeah, these are the kind of stories they would tell

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over in Oregon. But Jim, who you know, had this experience,

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told the new recruit who refused to use excessive force

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on migrants who were resisting arrest, he was like, you

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should have just shot the alien.

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Oh my god.

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And that was the kind of shit that that they

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used to do all the time, right, And I wish

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I had looked up and maybe we could do this

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later because they still have one more part. But I

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remember we talked about last episode about Jen but I

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think is her name, and the video she had with

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was We talked about it last nime, but I think

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she talked about actually.

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Don't know if this was not. She has two videos

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with him, but.

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She talked about how in a certain time span of decades,

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there has been no border patrol or ice agent that

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has been held to account at all for killing a migrant,

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like they get away with it. And I'm trying to

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remember during this time if anyone had ever been any

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officer had ever been had ever been convicted or phase

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charges or arrested for violence against migrants.

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But I don't think so.

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I think that because we talked about migrants, you know,

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being violent. Not sorry, now migrants, border patrols just being

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violent and the reform that happened, and that they were

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murdering people, but it seemed like it was like outside

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of right. And you know what I think, whenever border

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patriusians seemed to be actually reprimanded or comfort anything is

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for outside things that don't happen within border patrol because

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like I you know, what comes to mind is that

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Juana with Thieves, a serial killer border patrol agent. He

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you know, we don't know what his record looks like

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within the agency, his work in there, but he literally

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killed the four five women. Yeah, but that seems to

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be the only time they are held to any sort

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of account. But just because the new generation of border

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patrol officers didn't engage in the same kind of violence

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doesn't mean they were any better than the Oldheimer's Okay,

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that's okay. In fact, in many ways they were even

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worse because they ushered in a new form of violence

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that we are still dealing with today even worse ways,

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and one that costs has caused even more harm and

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depths to migrants. But before we get there, there's a

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lot of information in the book about the Mexican government

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working with the US government to create the Betaseta program

226
00:12:43.879 --> 00:12:46.759
and how they work together to police Mexican migrants who

227
00:12:46.799 --> 00:12:50.080
were ineligible for the better set of program. And we'll

228
00:12:50.080 --> 00:12:51.960
only touch briefly on it for the take of time,

229
00:12:52.679 --> 00:12:54.440
but if you want to learn more, this book talks

230
00:12:54.480 --> 00:12:58.720
about that the best Utter program was established after negotiations

231
00:12:58.759 --> 00:13:01.200
between the US and mex to go to create a

232
00:13:01.399 --> 00:13:04.960
controlled and managed system of legal migration. And the thing

233
00:13:05.080 --> 00:13:07.840
was that not all Mexicans were eligible to be rescoto,

234
00:13:07.960 --> 00:13:10.600
so this didn't actually stop on tiction and trained to

235
00:13:10.600 --> 00:13:13.440
the US by Mexican migrants. Yeah, and not to mention

236
00:13:13.919 --> 00:13:16.960
the Brasco program was also created in part not only

237
00:13:17.000 --> 00:13:21.879
because Mexico wanted the workers back to actually work in

238
00:13:21.919 --> 00:13:26.879
Mexico too, but they also wanted to create standards to

239
00:13:26.960 --> 00:13:31.440
protect Mexicans who were going and facing like horrible working conditions.

240
00:13:31.679 --> 00:13:37.000
If you were a farm owner employing Brasselo people in

241
00:13:37.039 --> 00:13:40.000
the Resco program, you were supposed to do certain things. Yeah,

242
00:13:40.080 --> 00:13:42.080
and they weren't and the lot of the time they

243
00:13:42.120 --> 00:13:45.480
weren't into it. More about that aspect of it and

244
00:13:45.519 --> 00:13:48.960
how Texas refused for a long time to participate in

245
00:13:49.000 --> 00:13:51.440
the MATACTA program because of the standards that they were

246
00:13:51.480 --> 00:13:55.279
supposed to be meeting, and they eventually did agree, and

247
00:13:55.440 --> 00:13:59.799
some brascos still faced bad conditions, but.

248
00:14:00.080 --> 00:14:01.360
Was supposed to help out with that.

249
00:14:01.759 --> 00:14:03.799
Yeah, and it was supposed to set like a price,

250
00:14:04.120 --> 00:14:07.240
like a certain wage. But then there were still undocumented

251
00:14:07.279 --> 00:14:08.919
workers that were not part of the rest of the

252
00:14:08.919 --> 00:14:12.000
program crossing into it, and still farm owners hiring them

253
00:14:12.039 --> 00:14:15.080
over the rest of the program workers because they didn't

254
00:14:15.120 --> 00:14:17.720
have to meet any of those standards, and that caused

255
00:14:17.720 --> 00:14:19.960
a lot of conflict between Mexico and the US that

256
00:14:20.000 --> 00:14:23.240
we're going to get into next episode. But also like

257
00:14:23.279 --> 00:14:26.440
the Mexican government was like saying these things and trying

258
00:14:26.440 --> 00:14:28.840
to put these protections in place, by the same time,

259
00:14:28.879 --> 00:14:33.720
they were helping the United States subjugate migrants who were

260
00:14:33.759 --> 00:14:38.799
unauthorized undocumented migrants. Yeah, and they're in lies the hypocrisy

261
00:14:38.879 --> 00:14:46.840
of no but yeah. Yeah. So only healthy, landless and

262
00:14:46.919 --> 00:14:51.559
surplus mile agricultural workers from regions that weren't experiencing a

263
00:14:51.639 --> 00:14:54.200
labor shortage were qualified to apply to the rest of

264
00:14:54.200 --> 00:14:58.320
the program, and many Mexican women and children began immigrating

265
00:14:58.399 --> 00:15:02.879
into the United States dura, this time without authorization, so

266
00:15:02.919 --> 00:15:06.759
they could be together with their husbands and dads, and

267
00:15:07.639 --> 00:15:09.799
so did many of the Mexican men who were in

268
00:15:09.919 --> 00:15:14.000
eligible for the program. So the US and Mexican government

269
00:15:14.840 --> 00:15:17.720
forged a partnership during World War two, not only to

270
00:15:17.919 --> 00:15:21.399
establish the rest of the program, but to work together

271
00:15:21.480 --> 00:15:23.759
to police the Mexicans that had been left out of

272
00:15:23.759 --> 00:15:27.399
the program. And with this partnership, the Mexican government linked

273
00:15:27.399 --> 00:15:31.279
its economic development to the United States, which was the

274
00:15:31.320 --> 00:15:35.399
ultimate downfall, which one might say was not the right

275
00:15:35.440 --> 00:15:37.879
thing to do. It's never the right move to link

276
00:15:37.919 --> 00:15:42.159
yourself as a country from the global self to the US.

277
00:15:47.360 --> 00:15:51.799
So then President Manuel La Villa Camacho hoped to strengthen

278
00:15:51.840 --> 00:15:55.519
the economy through industrialization with the help of the US.

279
00:15:55.919 --> 00:16:01.080
And at a time, many Mexican labor activists, intellectuals, elits, artists,

280
00:16:01.120 --> 00:16:05.080
and politicians believe that industrialization would solve all of the

281
00:16:05.159 --> 00:16:09.399
economic struggles, and they placed social justice ideals like wealth

282
00:16:09.440 --> 00:16:14.639
redistribution on the back burner, placing capital accumulation as more important.

283
00:16:14.679 --> 00:16:19.480
So they thought capitalism did that Capitalism.

284
00:16:20.759 --> 00:16:22.159
Yeah, I mean I was going to.

285
00:16:22.200 --> 00:16:25.720
Go like a roundabout way of saying it, but yeah,

286
00:16:25.720 --> 00:16:30.960
they thought that capitalism would solve the wealth inequalities of Mexico.

287
00:16:31.600 --> 00:16:36.120
And now I'm like, in what world, honey, and what world? Yeah,

288
00:16:36.279 --> 00:16:39.759
as victims of capitalism, we know now that that wealth

289
00:16:40.120 --> 00:16:43.639
that it happens because of it, It only is sort

290
00:16:43.679 --> 00:16:46.679
of select, pre selected, if you will, group of people.

291
00:16:47.159 --> 00:16:50.960
I furthers wealth inequality. Capitalism further is wealth inequality. You

292
00:16:51.159 --> 00:16:56.600
need impoverished people. You'll need a working class to make

293
00:16:56.679 --> 00:17:00.519
capitalism work. Someone has to work, and that's not the

294
00:17:00.519 --> 00:17:02.320
people on the top, and they're the ones that are

295
00:17:02.360 --> 00:17:04.079
going to ultimately make the most money.

296
00:17:04.440 --> 00:17:04.680
Yeah.

297
00:17:05.480 --> 00:17:08.480
And so this eagerness to create capital opened up business

298
00:17:08.480 --> 00:17:12.960
opportunities in Mexico for the United States, and both United

299
00:17:12.960 --> 00:17:18.640
States and Mexican businessmen took advantage of the situation. And

300
00:17:18.680 --> 00:17:24.039
there's more detail information to this perano. They gained their wealth,

301
00:17:24.119 --> 00:17:26.279
they hoarded it, they screwed over the poor and working

302
00:17:26.279 --> 00:17:31.200
class Mexicans m HM. As part of these business agreements

303
00:17:31.200 --> 00:17:36.640
and partnerships, the US and Mexican Commission advocated. I think

304
00:17:36.640 --> 00:17:39.680
there's more to that commission, but I don't wrote commission.

305
00:17:40.200 --> 00:17:42.000
I think it was like some agricultural or some shit.

306
00:17:42.119 --> 00:17:46.680
But whatever, Oh, Okay. They advocated shifting agricultural production away

307
00:17:46.720 --> 00:17:50.920
from domestic products and more towards oil and seeds, which

308
00:17:50.920 --> 00:17:54.240
had been designated as essential for the wifort. And this

309
00:17:54.279 --> 00:17:55.559
is where monsanto comes in.

310
00:17:57.519 --> 00:17:59.960
That's not a fact. But it does lead.

311
00:17:59.880 --> 00:18:02.640
To famine though, and yeah, of course it did.

312
00:18:03.359 --> 00:18:03.559
So.

313
00:18:03.880 --> 00:18:07.200
This meant that between nineteen forty two and nineteen forty three,

314
00:18:07.240 --> 00:18:12.200
seven hundred thousand hectors were reassigned from producing corn to

315
00:18:12.319 --> 00:18:16.400
instead producing war related products, and the combination of fewer

316
00:18:16.440 --> 00:18:19.880
hectors being planted and bad conditions led to near famine

317
00:18:19.880 --> 00:18:21.200
conditions in most of Mexico.

318
00:18:21.960 --> 00:18:23.359
Wow, I didn't know this.

319
00:18:23.920 --> 00:18:27.359
Yeah, I'm either. In Durango, things were so bad that

320
00:18:27.400 --> 00:18:31.160
the governor seized a railroad car of corn that was

321
00:18:31.200 --> 00:18:33.279
on its way to Mexico City so he could feed

322
00:18:33.359 --> 00:18:38.880
his people. Wow. And the food schorges continued during most

323
00:18:38.880 --> 00:18:40.960
of the nineteen forties, and the poor were the most

324
00:18:40.960 --> 00:18:44.599
affected since they relied the most on corn as a

325
00:18:44.599 --> 00:18:46.119
staple to their diets.

326
00:18:46.680 --> 00:18:48.920
Oh my god.

327
00:18:49.359 --> 00:18:53.000
As Kelly wrote, the decisions made by the US and

328
00:18:53.160 --> 00:18:56.680
Mexican officials to shift production away from the meslive products

329
00:18:57.160 --> 00:19:00.480
reflects the premacy of war production in their decision and

330
00:19:00.640 --> 00:19:03.759
the collusion of the Mexican and the US elite in

331
00:19:03.799 --> 00:19:06.960
the pursuit of a system of Mexican economic development that

332
00:19:07.000 --> 00:19:10.960
did not benefit the Mexican poor. So of course, these

333
00:19:10.960 --> 00:19:15.519
neo famine conditions led to more unsanctioned border crossings, despite

334
00:19:15.640 --> 00:19:18.000
the establishment of the rest of the program, which is

335
00:19:18.039 --> 00:19:21.839
supposed to resolve the problem of quote illegal immigration. And

336
00:19:21.920 --> 00:19:25.519
so it's like I've been saying since forever, always, forever

337
00:19:25.599 --> 00:19:30.880
and always, the reason that there are undocumented people here,

338
00:19:31.880 --> 00:19:35.480
not even only on documented people, but like asilum seekers, refugees,

339
00:19:36.119 --> 00:19:39.039
immigrants is directly because of the United States.

340
00:19:39.119 --> 00:19:40.240
Here we have an example.

341
00:19:40.720 --> 00:19:44.160
And sure Mexicani also the Mexican elite was a part

342
00:19:44.160 --> 00:19:46.960
of this, but they would not have made this deal

343
00:19:47.000 --> 00:19:49.759
with the United States if the United States elite and

344
00:19:49.839 --> 00:19:53.000
capital interests were not wanting to take advantage of these

345
00:19:53.000 --> 00:19:57.599
conditions in Mexico. And because they made this financial agreement

346
00:19:58.240 --> 00:20:03.079
for them to gain wealth cause famine, yeah, near famine

347
00:20:03.079 --> 00:20:06.440
conditions in Mexico, and people, people gotta eat, people gotta work.

348
00:20:08.039 --> 00:20:09.079
They enter the.

349
00:20:09.039 --> 00:20:13.799
United States as undocumented immigrants because of the United States.

350
00:20:14.640 --> 00:20:16.519
So I'm like, don't you owe these people something you

351
00:20:16.559 --> 00:20:20.640
are causing their starvation. Yeah, so yeah, I believe that

352
00:20:20.680 --> 00:20:24.480
the United States owes all of us as the Senates

353
00:20:24.519 --> 00:20:28.119
of the Global South. Like we wouldn't be here if

354
00:20:28.119 --> 00:20:31.960
they had just left our parents' countries alone and let

355
00:20:32.000 --> 00:20:37.039
them thrive. Yes, we wouldn't be here, So shut the

356
00:20:37.039 --> 00:20:39.920
fuck up, and people wouldn't be trying to come here

357
00:20:40.000 --> 00:20:43.599
because they continue to subjectate the Global South.

358
00:20:44.240 --> 00:20:44.440
Yeah.

359
00:20:44.480 --> 00:20:46.359
I was gonna say, you could say everything you just

360
00:20:46.400 --> 00:20:50.240
said in any time period and it applies. It applied

361
00:20:50.279 --> 00:20:55.319
then since colonization, and it applies now. Foreveren always exactly

362
00:20:55.519 --> 00:21:02.319
forever as always. We laugh because it's different, because it hurts,

363
00:21:03.000 --> 00:21:03.680
it hurts us.

364
00:21:03.759 --> 00:21:06.759
Yeah. If we don't laugh, we cry. I'm sorry. I

365
00:21:06.799 --> 00:21:07.920
know a lot of people hate him.

366
00:21:07.920 --> 00:21:14.400
I'm sorry. Both the US Border Patrol and Mexican agricultural

367
00:21:14.440 --> 00:21:19.880
businessmen were opposed to unsactioned Mexican immigration and Mexican businessmen

368
00:21:20.000 --> 00:21:23.720
were demanding that both the United States and Mexican governments

369
00:21:23.759 --> 00:21:27.519
do something about this rise in immigration because it affects

370
00:21:27.519 --> 00:21:31.839
their bottom line, and the Mexican government also urged US

371
00:21:31.920 --> 00:21:35.319
Immigration enforcement to do something about it. In a meeting

372
00:21:35.519 --> 00:21:40.359
with US Federal agencies, including the ins and border patrol.

373
00:21:40.440 --> 00:21:43.480
A Mexican government official complained about the great number of

374
00:21:43.559 --> 00:21:47.880
laborers that were successfully gaining unlawful entry into the US

375
00:21:48.440 --> 00:21:50.880
and urged the US government to fix the problem because

376
00:21:50.920 --> 00:21:56.079
Mexico was facing labor shortages too, and Mexico even often

377
00:21:56.200 --> 00:21:59.200
threatened to revise or revoke the best of the program,

378
00:21:59.400 --> 00:22:02.480
and they did it. But we'll get into that next episode.

379
00:22:03.000 --> 00:22:04.839
I was gonna say, I feel like I covered a

380
00:22:04.880 --> 00:22:08.119
time period where it was revoked completely and it led

381
00:22:08.160 --> 00:22:13.279
to something happening, but I can't remember. Was it a riot,

382
00:22:14.519 --> 00:22:17.480
maybe the So I'm gonna talk about it more next episode,

383
00:22:17.519 --> 00:22:19.200
because there was a lot of conflicts during the rest

384
00:22:19.240 --> 00:22:23.000
of the program. Of course it affected Mexican migrants. But

385
00:22:23.039 --> 00:22:25.279
there was a time period where the Mexican government, because

386
00:22:25.279 --> 00:22:29.640
of the labor shortages of Mexicans emigrating, you know, into

387
00:22:29.680 --> 00:22:35.079
the United States, the Mexican military popped themselves in front

388
00:22:35.079 --> 00:22:38.799
of the border and prevented migrants from entering the United States.

389
00:22:39.160 --> 00:22:40.960
Oh wow, and I read.

390
00:22:40.839 --> 00:22:42.279
About a riot, but I can't remember if it was

391
00:22:42.279 --> 00:22:44.160
on that was on the Mexican side or on the

392
00:22:45.319 --> 00:22:47.920
but it was like related to that that's what I'm

393
00:22:47.960 --> 00:22:48.319
thinking of.

394
00:22:48.559 --> 00:22:49.039
It could be.

395
00:22:50.079 --> 00:22:54.440
Yeah, well it's like the saying, like people keep crying

396
00:22:54.440 --> 00:22:56.759
about the wall, the wall, the wall, but like Mexico

397
00:22:56.960 --> 00:22:59.119
is the wall and has always served that purpose in

398
00:22:59.160 --> 00:23:02.000
this time period to prevent their own workers from leaving

399
00:23:02.079 --> 00:23:05.440
Mexico and then in more recent times to prevent to

400
00:23:05.519 --> 00:23:08.480
hold people there so they don't cross. And it's like

401
00:23:08.759 --> 00:23:10.960
working for the United States in that way, where like

402
00:23:11.079 --> 00:23:14.799
again they are the wall, and it's not only working

403
00:23:14.839 --> 00:23:16.960
for but they all they wanted these things because it

404
00:23:17.000 --> 00:23:21.039
was also affecting the Mexican elites, the Mexican ranchers. Yeah right, yeah,

405
00:23:21.079 --> 00:23:23.799
I meant that more for now than back then. They're

406
00:23:23.839 --> 00:23:27.880
working for because now it's like preventing Haitian Central Americans

407
00:23:27.960 --> 00:23:30.440
or holding them at the border where conditions are.

408
00:23:31.759 --> 00:23:32.599
Not very rough.

409
00:23:34.599 --> 00:23:38.240
So a period of growth followed the US Border Patrol,

410
00:23:38.519 --> 00:23:40.759
and during this time and the work of the border

411
00:23:40.799 --> 00:23:44.480
patrol once again became even more focused. It's just I mean,

412
00:23:45.319 --> 00:23:47.759
it never really left, but they just get more and more,

413
00:23:48.839 --> 00:23:52.480
you know, concentrated at the US Mexico border, and the

414
00:23:52.640 --> 00:23:56.000
US and Mexican governments began working more closely together to

415
00:23:56.079 --> 00:24:01.079
prevent unauthorized migration and six month, oh, I guess during

416
00:24:01.079 --> 00:24:03.240
this time they were threatening to advise the BESIDA program

417
00:24:03.279 --> 00:24:06.160
until they agreed to you know, the conditions that they

418
00:24:06.200 --> 00:24:09.920
agreed to and whatnot. But six months after Mexico threatened

419
00:24:09.920 --> 00:24:14.160
to revise the program, the Border Patrol launched a new

420
00:24:14.160 --> 00:24:17.680
program of immigration law enforcement and many new methods of

421
00:24:17.799 --> 00:24:21.039
enforcement and policing were introduced. And this was because, right

422
00:24:21.039 --> 00:24:24.880
the Mexican government was pushing for more enforcement from the US.

423
00:24:24.960 --> 00:24:27.799
This is what they wanted, right, And so one of

424
00:24:27.839 --> 00:24:31.960
these new methods of enforcement and policing was called Special

425
00:24:32.039 --> 00:24:39.680
Mexican details also drives like Mexican drives, Mexican Special Mexican Drives,

426
00:24:39.680 --> 00:24:44.680
Special Mexican Deportation Parties, and the Mexican Explosion program. But

427
00:24:44.799 --> 00:24:47.200
basically these are old timy terms for what we can

428
00:24:47.240 --> 00:24:52.279
now understand as raids target rates. Okay, I was like,

429
00:24:52.319 --> 00:24:54.200
what is what are all these I was so confused

430
00:24:54.240 --> 00:24:57.519
when I first read Mexican deportation parties and I was like,

431
00:24:57.680 --> 00:25:00.440
are the partying because they're supporting Mexicans? But no, that's

432
00:25:00.440 --> 00:25:04.440
not what it means. But basically it means that they

433
00:25:04.599 --> 00:25:09.680
would temporarily reassigned border patrol officers from slower areas like

434
00:25:09.720 --> 00:25:15.480
Minnesota and North Dakota to hotspot areas like Chicago, Texas

435
00:25:15.480 --> 00:25:18.279
in LA, which actually makes a lot of sense, right,

436
00:25:18.319 --> 00:25:19.720
And so they were the hell were they doing in

437
00:25:19.720 --> 00:25:23.880
Minnesota anyways, That's what I'm saying, I guess to pretend

438
00:25:23.960 --> 00:25:27.640
to patrol the Canadian border. I don't know, right, And

439
00:25:27.839 --> 00:25:29.680
uh yeah, So they would move them from these other

440
00:25:29.720 --> 00:25:33.000
areas that were you know, not as quote I mean,

441
00:25:33.079 --> 00:25:35.279
not as immigrant heavy, I guess, and they would move

442
00:25:35.319 --> 00:25:38.119
them and they would have them do raids for periods

443
00:25:38.119 --> 00:25:40.119
of time and they would move them, reassign them. And

444
00:25:40.160 --> 00:25:43.279
that's why it was called like special like parties or drives.

445
00:25:44.000 --> 00:25:44.359
Wow.

446
00:25:44.960 --> 00:25:47.160
And this was like the first one of the There

447
00:25:47.279 --> 00:25:50.799
was not many raids before this period time frame, so

448
00:25:50.920 --> 00:25:54.599
this could be considered the inception of rains uh huh.

449
00:25:54.640 --> 00:25:57.680
And it was a precursor to the tactics that were

450
00:25:57.759 --> 00:26:04.599
used in operation went back. Oh wow, okay, And so yeah,

451
00:26:04.599 --> 00:26:07.519
the goal of these details was to increase apprehensions of

452
00:26:07.640 --> 00:26:11.559
undocumented Mexican immigrants. And I already mentioned that before this,

453
00:26:11.680 --> 00:26:15.599
the raids like this weren't really done, but the practice

454
00:26:15.640 --> 00:26:19.759
of these special details continued from about nineteen forty four

455
00:26:19.839 --> 00:26:23.599
until the nineteen fifties, and the fifties was when operation

456
00:26:23.680 --> 00:26:26.720
went back and then an operation went back to Gover yes,

457
00:26:26.880 --> 00:26:36.359
okay wow. And this practice of constantly reassigning border patrol

458
00:26:36.640 --> 00:26:42.039
agents affected the dynamics of the borderlands. And although racism

459
00:26:42.079 --> 00:26:44.799
and discrimination had always been a part of life in

460
00:26:44.839 --> 00:26:48.759
the borderlands, for the most part, border patrol agents used

461
00:26:48.759 --> 00:26:51.200
to work in the regions where they were raised and

462
00:26:51.279 --> 00:26:56.880
lived right right. They often were to maintain the status

463
00:26:56.920 --> 00:27:01.759
quo and the community, both ranchers in power and sometimes

464
00:27:01.839 --> 00:27:04.680
even the Mexican community. They often kept border patrol and

465
00:27:04.759 --> 00:27:09.160
check and border patrol when it was the old timers.

466
00:27:09.240 --> 00:27:12.720
They often work with ranchers like they're like, oh, hey,

467
00:27:12.880 --> 00:27:15.640
don't you know, don't take my migrants or my workers,

468
00:27:15.640 --> 00:27:19.880
like during this time, not yet after this time, you can, yeah,

469
00:27:20.000 --> 00:27:23.279
like things like that they would do. But now that

470
00:27:23.359 --> 00:27:27.039
there was newcomers and people that were not from these regions,

471
00:27:27.079 --> 00:27:29.599
they were not embedding themselves into the community like they

472
00:27:29.680 --> 00:27:35.880
used to. They didn't respect the old ways of community

473
00:27:35.920 --> 00:27:42.039
based Yeah patrolling was better, I mean yeah, I mean again,

474
00:27:42.079 --> 00:27:45.079
the centers are in hell so yeah, we're talking about

475
00:27:45.279 --> 00:27:51.240
comparing the low to even lower than that. Yeah, And like,

476
00:27:51.279 --> 00:27:54.720
for example, we talked about a couple episodes ago, I

477
00:27:54.720 --> 00:27:57.680
think maybe part one or two, where there was an instance,

478
00:27:57.839 --> 00:28:01.480
if we're one of the agents was going to shoot

479
00:28:01.480 --> 00:28:05.759
someone who had he had caught with alcohol during the prohibition,

480
00:28:06.240 --> 00:28:09.799
and he didn't because the community was like reacting and

481
00:28:09.880 --> 00:28:12.079
he was afraid they were going to surround him. So

482
00:28:12.200 --> 00:28:14.920
things like that were no longer really respected.

483
00:28:15.799 --> 00:28:16.240
Wow.

484
00:28:17.160 --> 00:28:19.960
And so yeah, with the new practice of the Special

485
00:28:20.000 --> 00:28:23.799
Details Border Patrol, and their families would move, you know,

486
00:28:24.400 --> 00:28:26.599
from town to town wherever they were being sent, and

487
00:28:26.640 --> 00:28:30.359
they would just rely on each other, be like a

488
00:28:30.400 --> 00:28:33.680
community within a community. This is and this is where

489
00:28:33.680 --> 00:28:39.000
you get, like the the more indoctrinated mindsets, the more

490
00:28:39.039 --> 00:28:41.720
like oh, we're brothers brothers in a yeah, the thin

491
00:28:41.799 --> 00:28:45.680
blue line, like more radicalization you could say, yeah, yeah,

492
00:28:45.720 --> 00:28:47.720
and then you carry I mean I feel like with

493
00:28:47.799 --> 00:28:50.680
every move and every town, even like maybe getting close

494
00:28:50.839 --> 00:28:54.880
to the border, they get more and more racist, yeah,

495
00:28:55.039 --> 00:28:59.119
xenophobic beliefs. But you pair that with like this newer

496
00:29:00.799 --> 00:29:04.519
within their own group, then yeah, that sounds very dangerous.

497
00:29:04.559 --> 00:29:09.680
I'm not surprised that things are worse, and because of

498
00:29:09.680 --> 00:29:12.440
this disconnect, the Border patrol agents were less likely to

499
00:29:12.599 --> 00:29:16.480
hold back and avoid upsetting local interests, like when the

500
00:29:16.559 --> 00:29:20.680
Central Office demanded increased enforcement and higher apprehension rates. And

501
00:29:21.000 --> 00:29:22.759
I think I'll just mention it now because I don't

502
00:29:22.759 --> 00:29:25.640
think I'll get into it next episode. But there were

503
00:29:25.680 --> 00:29:29.720
instances where Border patrol agents were in the past they

504
00:29:29.880 --> 00:29:34.480
would respect the ranchers and not really detain their workers.

505
00:29:34.759 --> 00:29:36.519
Now you know, that wasn't a thing anymore, and they

506
00:29:36.559 --> 00:29:38.000
would go in the middle of the night, they would

507
00:29:38.000 --> 00:29:41.160
do raids at the ranchers' homes. Ranchers would have standoffs

508
00:29:41.160 --> 00:29:42.400
with the bard patrol agents.

509
00:29:42.880 --> 00:29:44.000
Yes, I've heard about this.

510
00:29:44.279 --> 00:29:47.880
Yeah, even in the Border Patrol episodes of Behind the

511
00:29:47.920 --> 00:29:50.599
Bastards they talk about because you know he read this

512
00:29:50.599 --> 00:29:55.359
book too, and I'm just like, yeah, but you are, Robert, Yeah,

513
00:29:55.400 --> 00:30:01.359
exactly exactly. They talk about one instance where a border

514
00:30:01.359 --> 00:30:04.880
patrol agent was kind of like shocked that a twelve

515
00:30:04.960 --> 00:30:07.880
year old son of a rancher pointed a rifle at

516
00:30:07.960 --> 00:30:11.000
him and was like, get off our lands, and there

517
00:30:11.079 --> 00:30:14.119
was all I mean, obviously this was all wrong because

518
00:30:14.119 --> 00:30:18.839
the ranchers were taking advantage of the Mexican workers. During

519
00:30:18.880 --> 00:30:24.759
these conflicts and standoffs between the federal border Patrol and

520
00:30:24.960 --> 00:30:27.599
the ranchers, the ranchers would like talk to their kids

521
00:30:27.599 --> 00:30:30.160
about like, oh, this is this is wrong. This this

522
00:30:30.319 --> 00:30:35.160
is just like when the Civil War happened and the

523
00:30:35.240 --> 00:30:38.240
North was trying to take away the slaves from the South.

524
00:30:38.960 --> 00:30:40.480
So they would compare it to that and a laugh

525
00:30:40.559 --> 00:30:44.039
because it's disgusting. Yeah, so they would they were they

526
00:30:44.039 --> 00:30:47.839
would romanticize this like as a battle between the federal

527
00:30:47.839 --> 00:30:52.240
government and you know, the South. Yeah, but but it

528
00:30:52.279 --> 00:30:54.839
wasn't in the interests, of course of the workers. It

529
00:30:54.920 --> 00:30:57.640
was because of their own capitalist interests. And really the

530
00:30:57.640 --> 00:31:02.680
only comparison would be like the ranchers treated their workers

531
00:31:02.720 --> 00:31:09.680
in slaves like conditions. Yes, they were in shacks, you know,

532
00:31:10.279 --> 00:31:14.759
poor living conditions, almost unlivable living conditions. And yeah, and

533
00:31:14.799 --> 00:31:20.079
there's there are stories of ranchers having lookouts, like their

534
00:31:20.119 --> 00:31:22.640
sons would be looking out for raids. They would run

535
00:31:23.039 --> 00:31:27.079
warned their workers. The workers would scramble a nanny, you know,

536
00:31:27.160 --> 00:31:29.839
the kids took off the MiG The border patrol was like,

537
00:31:29.839 --> 00:31:34.720
where's your nanny, And they held they held this family

538
00:31:34.839 --> 00:31:37.000
like inside their homes, not at gunpoint, but they were

539
00:31:37.039 --> 00:31:39.640
like basically like entered their home like forcefully, and they're like.

540
00:31:39.640 --> 00:31:41.640
Where are your workers? Solves where your workers are at?

541
00:31:42.640 --> 00:31:44.440
So there was like a lot of things like that happening.

542
00:31:45.240 --> 00:31:45.680
Wow.

543
00:31:46.079 --> 00:31:49.119
Yeah, And that's just like an example of like, oh,

544
00:31:49.160 --> 00:31:52.240
these these are new border patrol who are not part

545
00:31:52.279 --> 00:31:54.640
of the community, and so they have no qualms and

546
00:31:54.680 --> 00:31:57.440
they're no again, no longer respecting the whole. Like oh

547
00:31:57.480 --> 00:32:00.599
wait until this day and then you can take the workers,

548
00:32:01.039 --> 00:32:03.519
deport them to detain them. But like before that, but

549
00:32:03.559 --> 00:32:06.279
now they're not. They were just going in whenever, and

550
00:32:06.319 --> 00:32:10.880
these standoffs were happening. Yeah, and where tween tween aged

551
00:32:10.960 --> 00:32:15.359
boys were pointing pointing guns at border patrol agents.

552
00:32:15.440 --> 00:32:16.640
Yeah.

553
00:32:17.160 --> 00:32:21.200
Man, that's the good old us of A for you though,

554
00:32:22.519 --> 00:32:24.480
Like it doesn't surprise me and it makes sense how

555
00:32:24.480 --> 00:32:26.519
that happened to me, but like just reading about that,

556
00:32:26.559 --> 00:32:26.920
I'm like.

557
00:32:26.880 --> 00:32:27.480
What the hock?

558
00:32:28.400 --> 00:32:33.720
Yeah yeah, And Kelly describes that the consequences were high

559
00:32:33.799 --> 00:32:37.039
for persons of Mexican origin in the borderlands as the

560
00:32:37.039 --> 00:32:41.160
border patrol surveillance expanded in the region. For example, interrogations

561
00:32:41.160 --> 00:32:45.119
by border patrol increased from four hundred and seventy three thousand,

562
00:32:45.279 --> 00:32:49.720
one hundred and twenty in nineteen forty to nine million,

563
00:32:49.720 --> 00:32:52.160
three hundred and eighty nine thousand, five hundred and fifty

564
00:32:52.160 --> 00:32:56.839
one in nineteen forty three. That's that percentage increases.

565
00:32:56.920 --> 00:32:59.920
Insane. I'm not doing it, but it's insane. I'm not.

566
00:33:00.160 --> 00:33:03.279
Yeah, but if we're going from the thousands to the millions,

567
00:33:03.759 --> 00:33:08.799
oh my god. And again, this demand of enforcement immigration

568
00:33:09.000 --> 00:33:12.400
enforcement was being pushed by the Mexican government too, So

569
00:33:12.480 --> 00:33:17.000
Kelly described the Mexican government helping Mexican Americans be recognized

570
00:33:17.039 --> 00:33:20.200
as white, you know, because this was there in their eyes,

571
00:33:20.240 --> 00:33:22.880
how they would not be discriminated against by aligning themselves

572
00:33:22.920 --> 00:33:29.200
with whiteness, right and pitting themselves against blackness basically, and

573
00:33:29.240 --> 00:33:34.079
that along with the battle for whiteness, Mexican officials participated

574
00:33:34.160 --> 00:33:37.480
in the mexicanization of the cast of illegals in the

575
00:33:37.559 --> 00:33:43.160
United States, so basically meaning that they helped define quote

576
00:33:43.200 --> 00:33:45.839
illegal immigration as Mexicans, they.

577
00:33:45.799 --> 00:33:49.200
Mexican mexicanized illegals.

578
00:33:49.680 --> 00:33:53.279
Basically, they helped Oh my god. Yeah, in the Mexican

579
00:33:53.319 --> 00:33:58.960
government helped in this in their own people, be your

580
00:33:58.960 --> 00:34:05.039
own people. Oh my god. I mean it makes sense.

581
00:34:05.039 --> 00:34:08.880
So it's everything I knew already, but like, yeah, period

582
00:34:08.880 --> 00:34:11.559
and being put into words, and it makes sense, right,

583
00:34:11.599 --> 00:34:14.840
because like the Mexican identity came to be with the

584
00:34:14.840 --> 00:34:18.800
subjugation of the indigenous and black people in Mexico to

585
00:34:18.920 --> 00:34:22.480
create the Mestiso. Yeah, so of course they would have

586
00:34:22.559 --> 00:34:27.960
no problem subjugating and because I mean realistically, it's the

587
00:34:28.000 --> 00:34:32.760
more impoverished Mexicans out lest Mexico for work in the

588
00:34:32.880 --> 00:34:35.320
United States, and those people tended to be more brown

589
00:34:35.360 --> 00:34:38.840
Mexicans and white Mexicans too, so like I'm sure they

590
00:34:38.880 --> 00:34:40.519
had an aspect to do with that.

591
00:34:42.000 --> 00:34:42.920
Wow.

592
00:34:43.960 --> 00:34:46.960
And the collaboration between the United States and the Mexican

593
00:34:47.000 --> 00:34:51.400
government and enforcing immigration laws grew during these special Mexican

594
00:34:51.440 --> 00:34:56.159
deportation parties because Mexico had never experienced this large amount

595
00:34:56.199 --> 00:35:00.800
of Mexican nationals returning to Mexico at a time, like

596
00:35:00.880 --> 00:35:09.199
all at once, you know, so collaborative deportations developed between

597
00:35:09.239 --> 00:35:13.480
the US and Mexico, and on January eleventh, nineteen forty five,

598
00:35:14.039 --> 00:35:17.880
US and Mexican authorities signed an agreement to work closely

599
00:35:17.960 --> 00:35:22.119
together to control the return of undocumented Mexican migrants and

600
00:35:22.199 --> 00:35:26.199
part of this agreement included diverting Mexicans who were not

601
00:35:26.400 --> 00:35:29.119
from the interior of Mexico to the interior of Mexico

602
00:35:30.039 --> 00:35:34.639
right when before they would just get deported and they

603
00:35:34.639 --> 00:35:38.480
would be, you know, in the border regions of Mexico. Yeah,

604
00:35:39.760 --> 00:35:41.760
and there's a memo that I was going to read,

605
00:35:42.519 --> 00:35:50.360
oh that described this collaboration on page one twenty. So

606
00:35:50.840 --> 00:35:54.760
this collaboration included like the United States Border Patrol taking

607
00:35:55.320 --> 00:35:59.960
the Mexican deportees to trains in Mexico or like bridges

608
00:36:00.039 --> 00:36:02.679
in the middle of Mexico and United States, and then

609
00:36:02.760 --> 00:36:07.280
exchanging custody paying for train rides into the interior. So

610
00:36:07.280 --> 00:36:11.239
that's what train lifts means. Okay, I'll just start over.

611
00:36:11.559 --> 00:36:14.159
As described in the nineteen fifty six memo, the procedure

612
00:36:14.159 --> 00:36:16.679
for the train lift to Chihuahua was for US Border

613
00:36:16.719 --> 00:36:19.960
Patrol officers to drive a busload of migrants to the

614
00:36:20.000 --> 00:36:24.480
middle of the bridge that connected Presidio, Texas to Okinaga, Mexico.

615
00:36:24.920 --> 00:36:27.079
At the middle of the bridge, all Border patrol and

616
00:36:27.199 --> 00:36:29.880
in ins personnel would leave the bus and return to

617
00:36:29.920 --> 00:36:33.760
the inspection station. As the US officers left bus, Mexican

618
00:36:33.800 --> 00:36:36.519
officers entered to conduct the party from the middle of

619
00:36:36.559 --> 00:36:40.079
the bridge the railroad station. At this point, the deportees

620
00:36:40.159 --> 00:36:44.360
and the financial responsibility for their detention, supervision, transportation, and

621
00:36:44.440 --> 00:36:47.679
care were officially transferred from the US to Mexico. So

622
00:36:47.719 --> 00:36:51.920
they were literally exchanging the deportees and then the Mexican

623
00:36:53.199 --> 00:36:57.719
Migration Department would train them into the interior of Mexico.

624
00:36:58.440 --> 00:36:58.840
Wow.

625
00:36:58.880 --> 00:37:04.320
And this disrupted because there was systems of support within

626
00:37:04.360 --> 00:37:06.719
the border towns already, so like migrants new where to

627
00:37:06.760 --> 00:37:08.400
go to be like, hey, can I stay here for

628
00:37:08.440 --> 00:37:11.639
the night, can you, you know, help me get food?

629
00:37:11.719 --> 00:37:15.440
Like things like that, And this disrupted the system supports

630
00:37:15.440 --> 00:37:20.480
system that was already exists, the system, yes, okay, And

631
00:37:20.559 --> 00:37:25.280
so I thought that Kelly described this perfectly. She said,

632
00:37:25.320 --> 00:37:29.320
in the US, those identified as illegal immigrants were subject

633
00:37:29.360 --> 00:37:33.360
to surveillance, attention, and deportation. In Mexico, they faced the

634
00:37:33.400 --> 00:37:38.920
disruptions and anxieties forced this location to unfamiliar places. Man.

635
00:37:40.400 --> 00:37:42.519
And this was yeah, hand in hand together.

636
00:37:42.719 --> 00:37:45.239
Yeah, And that's something she talks about like a lot,

637
00:37:45.280 --> 00:37:47.559
even the I think in the intro where people have

638
00:37:47.679 --> 00:37:54.079
this misconception that any immigration enforcement that Mexico has engaged

639
00:37:54.159 --> 00:37:58.119
in has been for the United States, like because they're

640
00:37:58.159 --> 00:38:00.039
being told to do so, but then in states, but

641
00:38:00.079 --> 00:38:02.280
that wasn't really the case, not during this time period.

642
00:38:02.280 --> 00:38:04.239
It was something they.

643
00:38:04.119 --> 00:38:07.920
Were demanding from the United States and in collaboration with

644
00:38:08.000 --> 00:38:10.800
the United States. And yeah, and that's such an important

645
00:38:10.840 --> 00:38:14.199
thing to point out. I think it points out like

646
00:38:14.840 --> 00:38:24.239
the state, yes, the nation state, right, it's not always looking.

647
00:38:24.119 --> 00:38:25.599
Out for the people.

648
00:38:26.599 --> 00:38:32.440
Yeah, that's probably the most polite way of seeing it. Yeah,

649
00:38:33.519 --> 00:38:36.320
and this was just one of the new determined strategies

650
00:38:37.320 --> 00:38:40.360
and probably one of the least worst ones. In nineteen

651
00:38:40.400 --> 00:38:43.880
forty five, the US Board Patrol started noticing that more

652
00:38:43.920 --> 00:38:47.480
crossings were happening in California as opposed to Texas, and

653
00:38:47.599 --> 00:38:51.800
to address this issue, they sent four thousand, five hundred

654
00:38:51.800 --> 00:38:57.400
feet of chain link fencing to Collexico, California. Chain link

655
00:38:57.519 --> 00:39:00.280
the tool of the oppressor, truly, And so yeah, they

656
00:39:00.320 --> 00:39:03.119
sent this chain link fencing too Colexico in California. And

657
00:39:03.159 --> 00:39:07.440
they then they sent leftover or like recycled chain link

658
00:39:07.519 --> 00:39:10.519
fence material to the Mexicans side of the border that

659
00:39:10.599 --> 00:39:13.480
had been used at the Japanese and German camps. So

660
00:39:13.519 --> 00:39:16.039
it's like literally like when you said, the tool of

661
00:39:16.079 --> 00:39:20.719
the oppressor. Like literally this chain link material had been

662
00:39:20.840 --> 00:39:26.159
used to subjugate and oppress Japanese immigrants and Japanese Americans

663
00:39:26.480 --> 00:39:30.239
was now being used to subjugate Mexican immigrants.

664
00:39:30.760 --> 00:39:34.280
Oh my god. I was like, of.

665
00:39:34.239 --> 00:39:37.360
Course, full loword. Yeah, like I would have never thought, like,

666
00:39:37.360 --> 00:39:39.480
where is the material coming from? Oh and it's been

667
00:39:39.599 --> 00:39:43.760
It's it's like double used for pressures by instead of

668
00:39:43.960 --> 00:39:46.320
trying to align with the whiteness. Everyone needs to align

669
00:39:46.400 --> 00:39:50.000
with each other, but we don't, Like we don't. Yeah,

670
00:39:50.039 --> 00:39:52.960
Like what we need is solidarity. Like appealing to whiteness

671
00:39:53.039 --> 00:39:55.800
is never gonna win that. We're never gonna win with that.

672
00:39:55.960 --> 00:39:58.480
If it's not you today, if it wasn't you yesterday,

673
00:39:58.519 --> 00:40:00.440
and it's not you today, it's gonna be used tomorrow.

674
00:40:02.320 --> 00:40:05.280
And so the goal of the fencing was to compel quote,

675
00:40:05.280 --> 00:40:08.440
to compel persons seeking to enter the US illegally to

676
00:40:08.480 --> 00:40:10.079
attempt to go around the ends.

677
00:40:10.039 --> 00:40:10.639
Of the fence.

678
00:40:11.639 --> 00:40:14.440
And at the end of the fence the fences defencing

679
00:40:16.159 --> 00:40:20.519
was desert and mountains, and the goal was to discourage

680
00:40:20.559 --> 00:40:25.719
illegal immigration by exposing migrants to the elements, to dehydration,

681
00:40:26.320 --> 00:40:27.920
to hypothermia, and.

682
00:40:27.880 --> 00:40:28.599
So the death.

683
00:40:29.079 --> 00:40:33.400
Yeah, and this was the first time this was done intentionally,

684
00:40:34.480 --> 00:40:40.159
purposefully as a deterrence method, And holes were cut into

685
00:40:40.159 --> 00:40:42.719
the fence pretty much immediately while they were building it.

686
00:40:43.079 --> 00:40:46.840
So the US asked Mexicali, which would be the Mexican

687
00:40:46.920 --> 00:40:49.679
side of the border, for help, and the governor happily

688
00:40:49.679 --> 00:40:52.519
obliged by providing soldiers to protect the fence while it

689
00:40:52.559 --> 00:40:53.159
was being built.

690
00:40:53.199 --> 00:40:54.480
So here we have another.

691
00:40:54.159 --> 00:40:59.480
Example of the Mexican government while working with the US

692
00:41:01.159 --> 00:41:04.920
to stop immigration. And so yeah, the Mexican government was

693
00:41:04.920 --> 00:41:08.039
complicit and forcing migrants to use more dangerous routes.

694
00:41:09.760 --> 00:41:11.320
Oh my god.

695
00:41:11.599 --> 00:41:14.119
The holes continued, though, because when there's a will, there's

696
00:41:14.119 --> 00:41:17.360
a way, And so Bard Patrol started doing sweeps in

697
00:41:17.400 --> 00:41:20.519
the middle of the night in the desert, and an

698
00:41:20.559 --> 00:41:24.320
officer described picking up migrants whose feet were completely frozen.

699
00:41:26.519 --> 00:41:27.000
And worse.

700
00:41:27.039 --> 00:41:30.400
I mean, I think we've all heard horror stories of yeah,

701
00:41:31.480 --> 00:41:35.400
locals down when you're crossing, yeah, and people that don't

702
00:41:35.400 --> 00:41:35.800
make it.

703
00:41:36.440 --> 00:41:37.840
Yeah.

704
00:41:38.280 --> 00:41:40.840
And by the nineteen fifties, it was a common occurrence

705
00:41:41.000 --> 00:41:46.840
to find the bodies of Mexican migrants in the desert

706
00:41:47.000 --> 00:41:47.519
in the water.

707
00:41:48.239 --> 00:41:49.079
Oh yeah, I don't.

708
00:41:48.920 --> 00:41:53.639
Remember what I was looking at recently where someone was

709
00:41:53.679 --> 00:41:57.119
like in between here and Mexico, like between the US

710
00:41:57.119 --> 00:41:59.840
and the Mexican border, it's a graveyard. Yeah, it is

711
00:42:00.519 --> 00:42:04.039
and has ever since this type of border protection the

712
00:42:04.079 --> 00:42:08.800
forties and fifties. Yeah, it's just been terrible, Like even

713
00:42:08.800 --> 00:42:11.079
out because this book is more on the dry side,

714
00:42:11.440 --> 00:42:17.000
but even reading about this, like I was crying because yeah,

715
00:42:17.199 --> 00:42:21.360
like so much people died. Yeah, just trying to make

716
00:42:21.360 --> 00:42:24.320
their way, you know, into the United States because of

717
00:42:24.360 --> 00:42:27.800
the United States and right forcing them.

718
00:42:28.159 --> 00:42:29.239
Yes, of course.

719
00:42:30.400 --> 00:42:34.119
In on February fourth, nineteen fifty to, an employee of

720
00:42:34.159 --> 00:42:38.960
the Imperial Valley Irrigation District found five dead Mexican mills

721
00:42:39.000 --> 00:42:42.559
near some small shrubs who had apparently succumbed to the

722
00:42:42.639 --> 00:42:46.159
extreme heat of the desert. And with more and more

723
00:42:46.280 --> 00:42:50.119
guardrails and roadblocks through the desert, many migrants started crossing

724
00:42:50.199 --> 00:42:54.719
through the All American Canal and the Rio Grande, and

725
00:42:54.760 --> 00:42:58.239
the border patrol knew the dangers of the waters, and

726
00:42:58.320 --> 00:43:02.239
knowing that migrants would not would likely not survive crossing

727
00:43:02.280 --> 00:43:04.480
these waters, they left them mostly unguarded.

728
00:43:05.559 --> 00:43:07.800
Yeah, they don't need to elpments. They are going to

729
00:43:07.880 --> 00:43:08.440
do it. For them.

730
00:43:08.519 --> 00:43:12.119
Yeah, and this reminds me of I think it was

731
00:43:12.199 --> 00:43:14.559
during an Operation Loan Star, which we were we are

732
00:43:14.599 --> 00:43:17.800
going to do an episode one, but when Abbot put

733
00:43:17.880 --> 00:43:22.920
up those boys that were like weaponized, right, Like, I

734
00:43:22.960 --> 00:43:25.599
don't obviously we're gonna actually research. This is just at

735
00:43:25.639 --> 00:43:27.960
the top of my head, but like these things were

736
00:43:28.000 --> 00:43:31.719
like causing more deaths. Yeah, and I don't know, I

737
00:43:31.800 --> 00:43:34.960
just I don't understand how horrible you can be as

738
00:43:35.000 --> 00:43:40.039
a person to defend defenders that has caused countless deaths. Yeah,

739
00:43:40.079 --> 00:43:43.199
but it's like shouldn't come here, But like I said,

740
00:43:43.559 --> 00:43:46.119
they are because of the United States.

741
00:43:46.519 --> 00:43:49.320
Yeah, like what do you want people to do?

742
00:43:51.559 --> 00:43:54.320
Starve and die? Obviously that's what they want. No, that's

743
00:43:54.320 --> 00:43:57.440
exactly what they want. And earlier I had mentioned how

744
00:43:57.519 --> 00:44:01.800
the new generation of Borbital didn't engage in the same

745
00:44:01.840 --> 00:44:07.599
outright violence as old timer's, but they were no better

746
00:44:07.639 --> 00:44:10.840
because this was way worse. They purposefully exposed migrants to

747
00:44:10.880 --> 00:44:13.639
the elements and pushed them further and further into more

748
00:44:13.719 --> 00:44:16.559
dangerous routes of crossing into the United States.

749
00:44:16.920 --> 00:44:18.800
But here now they can say, oh, what was in

750
00:44:18.880 --> 00:44:20.320
our fault? Exactly.

751
00:44:20.480 --> 00:44:27.280
My next points, God, the way your mind works. Yeah,

752
00:44:27.320 --> 00:44:30.639
and so Kelly wrote, quote, border patrol officers had given

753
00:44:30.719 --> 00:44:34.039
up their brutality, but the body count of migrants paying

754
00:44:34.079 --> 00:44:37.360
the penalty of death while trying to evade apprehensions for

755
00:44:37.559 --> 00:44:43.159
illegal immigration continued. Immigration law enforcement techniques shifted responsibility for

756
00:44:43.280 --> 00:44:48.599
the number of deaths associated with undocumented immigration to migrants themselves.

757
00:44:49.440 --> 00:44:52.719
No longer were apprehensions the primary side of danger. Rather,

758
00:44:52.840 --> 00:44:55.639
the border patrol had relocated the danger of immigration law

759
00:44:55.679 --> 00:44:59.280
enforcement to the natural landscape of the borderlands. Migrants battle

760
00:44:59.440 --> 00:45:03.760
deserts and rivers rather than men with guns end quote.

761
00:45:05.559 --> 00:45:11.159
And uh, yeah, they basically absolve themselves of any responsibility

762
00:45:11.159 --> 00:45:13.480
and guilt or the depth of migrants because they're like, oh,

763
00:45:13.480 --> 00:45:18.199
they're the ones crossing any guilt to begin with, right,

764
00:45:18.840 --> 00:45:21.679
But yeah, now they can wash their hands free of

765
00:45:22.119 --> 00:45:24.360
having to do it themselves, and they can say, oh,

766
00:45:24.400 --> 00:45:29.199
it's in God's hands now while they're putting in place

767
00:45:29.239 --> 00:45:33.039
the system that like, they have moved it to where

768
00:45:33.039 --> 00:45:35.239
they have to cross through here, and now they don't

769
00:45:35.280 --> 00:45:36.679
have to kill them themselves.

770
00:45:36.719 --> 00:45:37.639
The river is going to do it.

771
00:45:37.679 --> 00:45:41.800
Yeah, and Kelly described this as have you heard a

772
00:45:41.840 --> 00:45:43.679
foul called fa coal i? Don't know how to say

773
00:45:43.679 --> 00:45:46.639
his name. This sounds very fail that's wrong.

774
00:45:46.639 --> 00:45:47.280
How do you spell it?

775
00:45:47.599 --> 00:45:50.880
F o u c l f o U see a

776
00:45:51.159 --> 00:45:53.639
L T for call? Yeah, this sounds very It's like

777
00:45:53.639 --> 00:45:57.000
an important like literary figure or something. Yes, but I

778
00:45:57.000 --> 00:45:59.199
don't think we're not like, yeah, we're dumbidges.

779
00:45:59.239 --> 00:46:01.400
We don't know this. I'm so sorry. I don't know

780
00:46:01.480 --> 00:46:01.920
this man.

781
00:46:02.559 --> 00:46:05.280
But he had I guess he he I know if

782
00:46:05.320 --> 00:46:08.559
it's like he has like a lot of like grim writings.

783
00:46:08.679 --> 00:46:11.480
I guess French historian called French historian.

784
00:46:11.519 --> 00:46:14.199
Okay, so he's not a Michelle or Michael. How do

785
00:46:14.239 --> 00:46:16.519
they pronounce Michael? I thought maybe it was Mitchell an

786
00:46:16.559 --> 00:46:21.119
idea Michael, Like yeah, maybe because it's like Michael without

787
00:46:21.119 --> 00:46:25.840
an age, Yeah Michael. But yeah, so he had this

788
00:46:26.159 --> 00:46:29.079
French philosopher, historian and author and political actom Okay, Okay,

789
00:46:29.159 --> 00:46:30.599
he just always say a little more.

790
00:46:31.039 --> 00:46:31.280
Okay.

791
00:46:31.360 --> 00:46:32.920
Yeah, I'm like I knew he was some kind of

792
00:46:33.000 --> 00:46:37.400
literary figure because that's how I have heard of him.

793
00:46:37.639 --> 00:46:38.800
But again, we're dumb bitches.

794
00:46:39.639 --> 00:46:42.599
But apparently he has this this theory or like a

795
00:46:42.639 --> 00:46:45.480
theme theme that comes up in his writing a lot

796
00:46:45.639 --> 00:46:49.800
is the power to let die. And that's basically how

797
00:46:49.840 --> 00:46:53.840
she described, like, oh, the border patrol embraced this power

798
00:46:53.880 --> 00:46:57.159
to let die. And I'm gonna look into this man

799
00:46:58.320 --> 00:47:02.079
because maybe a little resid even more because it is spun on.

800
00:47:02.360 --> 00:47:06.800
It's like the state has the power to let anyone

801
00:47:06.800 --> 00:47:09.159
they choose die and they are doing so right now.

802
00:47:10.159 --> 00:47:13.280
They can choose who let live and let die, who

803
00:47:13.320 --> 00:47:17.480
gets to ascend the ladder of capitalism and who is

804
00:47:19.239 --> 00:47:22.880
flicked off and I don't know left to die. Yeah,

805
00:47:24.159 --> 00:47:29.880
it's disgusting and facet is onto something. Now let's lookt

806
00:47:29.880 --> 00:47:36.119
into him, let's read his work. We're like these dumb bitches.

807
00:47:37.400 --> 00:47:40.800
No again, we have never pascascinating anything. But everyone probably

808
00:47:40.800 --> 00:47:42.519
knows about except except us.

809
00:47:45.079 --> 00:47:47.719
Hey, I didn't go to college. I won't.

810
00:47:47.719 --> 00:47:51.840
I did like three separate half semesters. I have degrees,

811
00:47:52.239 --> 00:47:58.760
and my dumb bitch studies of psych major and I

812
00:47:58.760 --> 00:48:00.000
can speak for all psych majors.

813
00:48:00.239 --> 00:48:03.559
It didn't involve much. And then my ms.

814
00:48:04.280 --> 00:48:09.480
I didn't read this man, So I'm sorry to this man.

815
00:48:11.400 --> 00:48:15.840
But what a powerful theme, right, oh yeah yeah. And

816
00:48:16.280 --> 00:48:19.079
in nineteen forty nine, it was estimated that one person

817
00:48:19.239 --> 00:48:21.360
died every day while trying to cross into.

818
00:48:21.280 --> 00:48:22.000
The Rio Grande.

819
00:48:22.639 --> 00:48:27.000
Oh my god, wait year nineteen forty nine, okay, wow.

820
00:48:27.400 --> 00:48:30.239
And during this time more women and children began crossing

821
00:48:30.280 --> 00:48:32.840
it into the US, and they made up a lot

822
00:48:32.840 --> 00:48:35.559
of the migrants who unfortunately died trying to get into

823
00:48:35.559 --> 00:48:39.239
the US. And Kelly has more examples in the Book

824
00:48:39.360 --> 00:48:43.599
of Migrants you know that died crossing. I'm sorry, but

825
00:48:43.639 --> 00:48:48.079
I will always think of Oscar Roberto Martinez Ramidez and

826
00:48:48.079 --> 00:48:52.239
his twenty three month old daughter, Angi Valeria. Yeah, that's

827
00:48:52.599 --> 00:48:54.840
I literally had them in my mind as I was

828
00:48:54.880 --> 00:48:56.480
reading it. I think that's why I wanted to cry,

829
00:48:56.519 --> 00:49:00.440
because I remember, I'm going to cry right now. It

830
00:49:01.280 --> 00:49:06.960
is truly, it's it was the saddest thing to see

831
00:49:07.360 --> 00:49:10.079
and it was just him and his daughter, like a

832
00:49:10.119 --> 00:49:14.880
three shows year old little girl. Uh and yeah, they

833
00:49:15.159 --> 00:49:19.639
passed away trying to cross and like you know, borbatuts

834
00:49:19.679 --> 00:49:23.559
on the other side. It's just it's just inhumane, like

835
00:49:23.599 --> 00:49:27.639
how can you let well again, they have the power

836
00:49:27.679 --> 00:49:32.000
to let migrants die and you could easily like try

837
00:49:32.039 --> 00:49:34.800
to help these people, and they don't. They let them die.

838
00:49:36.320 --> 00:49:38.920
That image is forever and grazed in my head, and

839
00:49:38.960 --> 00:49:40.840
it literally had it in my head as I was

840
00:49:40.880 --> 00:49:45.960
reading about Yeah, any anytime I hear the river or

841
00:49:46.079 --> 00:49:50.199
especially right now that we're reading enforcement immigration enforcement at

842
00:49:50.199 --> 00:49:53.199
the river or people dying at this river, this is

843
00:49:53.239 --> 00:49:56.719
who I think of, just because it's I don't know,

844
00:49:56.800 --> 00:50:00.639
it was like you you you see it, and because

845
00:50:00.760 --> 00:50:05.199
you know who our parents are, we know like yeah, yeah,

846
00:50:05.320 --> 00:50:07.199
it's like this could have been them, This could have

847
00:50:07.239 --> 00:50:09.599
been any You're family loved the ones people we know

848
00:50:10.960 --> 00:50:14.079
and if we had been in another oh, it could

849
00:50:14.079 --> 00:50:16.760
have been us at some point. Yeah, if we had Yeah,

850
00:50:16.800 --> 00:50:19.039
we're saying the same thing. Yeah, I'm like, yeah, because

851
00:50:19.119 --> 00:50:25.320
we had the luck to be born here, Yeah, that

852
00:50:25.360 --> 00:50:27.800
could have been any one of us. And you know what,

853
00:50:27.920 --> 00:50:32.639
the further the you uh, a migrant is leaving their

854
00:50:32.639 --> 00:50:36.039
home country, the more dangerous their journey.

855
00:50:36.119 --> 00:50:38.280
Like you think about the da Yan.

856
00:50:38.239 --> 00:50:40.840
Gap, Oh my god, Yeah, horrors they have to go

857
00:50:40.920 --> 00:50:43.119
through and then to go and get here and then

858
00:50:43.199 --> 00:50:45.960
like be held up by Mexico so long that they

859
00:50:45.960 --> 00:50:48.159
are desperately like you know what, fuck it, let's go

860
00:50:48.239 --> 00:50:50.639
through the river and then possibly die at the river.

861
00:50:50.960 --> 00:50:55.840
Like that's already surviving the gap, Like yes, and it's

862
00:50:55.920 --> 00:51:00.719
just like like I don't care who because people are thinking,

863
00:51:00.960 --> 00:51:03.840
you have to have some rules, Like why, I really.

864
00:51:04.119 --> 00:51:05.519
Why, That's what I said last time.

865
00:51:05.599 --> 00:51:09.320
Why should there be rules when the United States doesn't

866
00:51:09.360 --> 00:51:11.400
have rules when they're over there fucking up the rest

867
00:51:11.400 --> 00:51:14.079
of the world. No, exactly, they don't give one fine

868
00:51:14.119 --> 00:51:17.920
fuck about rules. They're over here shooting Venezuelans who are

869
00:51:17.920 --> 00:51:22.320
currently fishermen. Yeah, they're making up gangs. They have literally

870
00:51:22.360 --> 00:51:27.880
made up cartels to cause violence, to shoot people. Like

871
00:51:27.960 --> 00:51:29.960
they made up a whole cartel. I forgot the name

872
00:51:30.000 --> 00:51:30.280
of it.

873
00:51:30.760 --> 00:51:31.559
It doesn't exist.

874
00:51:31.599 --> 00:51:34.159
They made it up just to have an excuse to

875
00:51:34.199 --> 00:51:38.679
go shoot up some people. And they're literally extra judicially

876
00:51:38.880 --> 00:51:44.840
killing Venezuelans right now. M and for what they are

877
00:51:44.920 --> 00:51:50.920
just discussing and humane people who want to kill the

878
00:51:50.920 --> 00:51:57.480
rest of us, honestly, Yeah, yeah, and yeah. In the book,

879
00:51:57.519 --> 00:52:01.039
she talks about an eleven year old girl who and

880
00:52:01.079 --> 00:52:04.639
she says her name I remember right now, but but

881
00:52:04.840 --> 00:52:06.880
just it's so many people that have lost their lives.

882
00:52:07.920 --> 00:52:10.960
And I remember also like something else that I'm like

883
00:52:10.960 --> 00:52:13.280
always thinking about, especially around Day of the Dead. I

884
00:52:13.320 --> 00:52:19.000
remember years ago some artists made like a almost like

885
00:52:19.000 --> 00:52:21.800
an altar but they put up like figures of like

886
00:52:21.920 --> 00:52:26.440
skeletons hanging on the fence of the border, like to

887
00:52:26.519 --> 00:52:28.800
represent all the people that have lost their lives.

888
00:52:29.480 --> 00:52:31.199
They put this at at the border.

889
00:52:31.960 --> 00:52:35.039
Oh yeah, I haven't seen this, And you know what,

890
00:52:35.119 --> 00:52:38.719
this is why I'm sick of Like people on TikTok

891
00:52:38.840 --> 00:52:40.440
love the phrase like, oh, you don't have to see

892
00:52:40.440 --> 00:52:42.719
yourself as victims or I'm tired. I'm tired of this

893
00:52:42.840 --> 00:52:50.440
victim mentality of the understand that. I'm like, where's your empathy?

894
00:52:50.599 --> 00:52:52.840
Some of us are not so far removed, Like our

895
00:52:52.920 --> 00:52:56.559
parents made this journey. Our grandparents made this journey. Yes,

896
00:52:57.039 --> 00:53:00.519
and a lot of people themselves made the journey exactly. Yeah.

897
00:53:00.639 --> 00:53:04.639
And so anytime I hear the words victim mentality, I'm like,

898
00:53:04.679 --> 00:53:06.679
those are the worst of the colonizer. I'm sorry, but

899
00:53:06.719 --> 00:53:10.119
they are because there's something there's a mentality. But then

900
00:53:10.119 --> 00:53:12.199
there's some things that are just the objective truth, and

901
00:53:12.280 --> 00:53:17.199
that's that like colonization was real. The US and their

902
00:53:17.360 --> 00:53:21.400
policies foreign policy has created a my great immigration crisis

903
00:53:22.760 --> 00:53:24.800
and like you haven't saying this whole time, none of

904
00:53:24.920 --> 00:53:29.039
us would be here. Yeah, And I feel like to

905
00:53:29.079 --> 00:53:33.760
anyone who thinks like, oh, they're they're tired of these stories.

906
00:53:34.559 --> 00:53:38.280
You should read more books that like, like, what is

907
00:53:38.320 --> 00:53:40.239
it the one that I still have to read a button?

908
00:53:40.519 --> 00:53:43.039
All of those all of us who are here are gone?

909
00:53:43.039 --> 00:53:44.679
What is it called? Oh?

910
00:53:44.800 --> 00:53:46.480
I have a right here one?

911
00:53:46.719 --> 00:53:50.519
Okay, there's there's the one we both read that's by

912
00:53:50.559 --> 00:53:55.840
a journalist. You're talking about everyone who is gone is here?

913
00:53:56.599 --> 00:53:56.920
Yes?

914
00:53:57.440 --> 00:53:59.719
That one, amazing, amazing book.

915
00:54:00.239 --> 00:54:01.840
Hold, I'm putting my stack back. Do you have the

916
00:54:01.880 --> 00:54:03.960
other one with you? Two? Or? Now which one was

917
00:54:03.960 --> 00:54:05.760
the other one? The other one is.

918
00:54:07.199 --> 00:54:10.960
The one that talks about the nine to eleven immigrants,

919
00:54:11.039 --> 00:54:14.719
the immigrants that died on nine to eleven, that they

920
00:54:14.719 --> 00:54:16.559
call them the Delivery Voice.

921
00:54:16.639 --> 00:54:19.280
Is it the same book? Oh?

922
00:54:19.320 --> 00:54:23.440
I know we're talking about the undocumented Americans, right, yes,

923
00:54:23.559 --> 00:54:26.800
Oh my god, yeah, read read those books before your

924
00:54:26.800 --> 00:54:32.880
link entire This narrative persists because these stories are still

925
00:54:33.960 --> 00:54:36.960
never ending, like they're ongoing.

926
00:54:37.119 --> 00:54:37.840
Shut the puck up.

927
00:54:39.679 --> 00:54:42.480
But I mean, yeah that basically, after all of our tears,

928
00:54:43.199 --> 00:54:46.159
the only other thing I was mentioning was that more

929
00:54:46.159 --> 00:54:51.039
women and children were uh crossing, and a lot of

930
00:54:51.079 --> 00:54:55.480
them died, as did many men crossing into the US

931
00:54:56.079 --> 00:54:58.800
and but during this time, the Board Patrol was wary

932
00:54:59.000 --> 00:55:01.880
of the optics of detaining women and children because they

933
00:55:01.880 --> 00:55:05.199
didn't want the negative attention of screaming children and crying women.

934
00:55:05.840 --> 00:55:08.280
I say, they still cared about this. Yeah, that's literally

935
00:55:08.320 --> 00:55:11.000
what I have write down. Yeah, they still cared about this.

936
00:55:15.079 --> 00:55:18.519
They often they didn't detain families, right, and they also

937
00:55:18.679 --> 00:55:21.440
wouldn't separate them. They wouldn't put them on the bus

938
00:55:21.480 --> 00:55:24.760
lifts or the airlifts what are they're called. And they

939
00:55:24.800 --> 00:55:28.880
would complain that once because if there's one thing that

940
00:55:28.960 --> 00:55:34.599
we are as our people are resilient and uh, what's

941
00:55:34.639 --> 00:55:40.440
the other word that you you learn your situation and

942
00:55:40.519 --> 00:55:45.119
you like that whustas at dol Like I can't think

943
00:55:45.159 --> 00:55:49.280
of the word silient, and like you, I know, you

944
00:55:49.320 --> 00:55:51.239
know what word I'm trying to say. I cannot think

945
00:55:51.280 --> 00:55:52.880
of it. I do because we had to say it

946
00:55:52.920 --> 00:55:55.840
a bunch of the army. Oh okay, I know, it's

947
00:55:55.840 --> 00:55:57.079
like at the tip of my tongue and I can't

948
00:55:57.079 --> 00:56:01.519
remember it. But it's like they learn you're like flexible

949
00:56:01.599 --> 00:56:05.199
or whatever. Yeah you readjust like a yeah, I don't know, readjusted.

950
00:56:05.960 --> 00:56:09.079
And so the migrants cut on real quick, that the

951
00:56:09.159 --> 00:56:13.519
border patrol would would be hesitant to detain families, and

952
00:56:13.559 --> 00:56:15.960
so they would just grab onto each other like as.

953
00:56:15.880 --> 00:56:19.199
Couples and children and they were related, and they'd be like,

954
00:56:19.239 --> 00:56:22.679
we're family. Oh my god. I love that. Yeah. I

955
00:56:22.719 --> 00:56:24.239
love that because they have to do what they have

956
00:56:24.360 --> 00:56:25.920
to do. Yeah, And there's a lot.

957
00:56:25.760 --> 00:56:27.599
Of stories in here that I haven't you know, got

958
00:56:27.639 --> 00:56:31.880
to talk about about migrants finding back. There's one I

959
00:56:31.920 --> 00:56:34.280
read about where the I don't remember I it was

960
00:56:34.320 --> 00:56:36.800
a Mexican border patrol or the US Border patrol, but

961
00:56:36.880 --> 00:56:39.559
they were like trying to like detain migrants and then

962
00:56:39.559 --> 00:56:41.360
the migrants are like, wait, there's more of us than

963
00:56:41.400 --> 00:56:46.280
you guys. And there's there's stories of resistance within this.

964
00:56:46.360 --> 00:56:50.400
Of course there is, there's always yes. I also read

965
00:56:50.400 --> 00:56:54.559
about the migrants who escaped through like air vents when

966
00:56:54.599 --> 00:56:57.400
they were being detained, and you know that kind of stuff.

967
00:56:57.440 --> 00:57:03.159
It helps to read this because it's it's hard and

968
00:57:03.199 --> 00:57:05.599
it's hard to know, you know, everything that's going on,

969
00:57:05.719 --> 00:57:08.320
but like we know, there's always you know, there's always

970
00:57:08.360 --> 00:57:12.920
people resisting, and it's important to focus on that. And

971
00:57:13.440 --> 00:57:15.719
I guess, yeah, that's a good place to leave off.

972
00:57:16.880 --> 00:57:20.400
Next week we'll talk a little bit more about collaboration

973
00:57:20.639 --> 00:57:23.159
between the US, but also conflict between the Mexico and

974
00:57:23.159 --> 00:57:27.679
the Mexico and the US about immigration, the establishment of

975
00:57:27.679 --> 00:57:29.840
the Mexican Border Patrol, because so far we have been

976
00:57:29.880 --> 00:57:36.800
talking about the Mexican Department of Migration. Oh wow, okay, Yeah,

977
00:57:36.840 --> 00:57:39.840
and then some more in humanity perpetrated by both the

978
00:57:39.920 --> 00:57:43.199
United States and the Mexican Border Patrol, and that'll be

979
00:57:43.519 --> 00:57:47.199
that'll be the last part. I am sick of talking

980
00:57:47.199 --> 00:57:50.239
about border patrol. We're not gonna be done because I'm

981
00:57:50.320 --> 00:57:54.320
gonna after this, I'm doing an episode on Operation Lone

982
00:57:54.320 --> 00:57:57.119
Star that I always forget. I think we said that's

983
00:57:57.119 --> 00:58:00.559
what it was called. We think it's what if if

984
00:58:00.559 --> 00:58:02.079
that's not what it's called. We're just talking about the

985
00:58:02.199 --> 00:58:09.159
increased border security operation that happened in Texas, which we

986
00:58:09.199 --> 00:58:12.440
are now seeing I guess, implemented in an even larger scale,

987
00:58:12.639 --> 00:58:15.519
leaching wide. But yeah, it's like you were saying, even

988
00:58:16.159 --> 00:58:19.199
right now and back then, there's always stories of resistance,

989
00:58:19.239 --> 00:58:21.360
and that's that's what we had to hold on to. Yeah,

990
00:58:21.960 --> 00:58:25.199
that and learning, learning so we can readjust so we

991
00:58:25.239 --> 00:58:29.000
can yeah, adjust, not readjust I don't know something, do

992
00:58:29.000 --> 00:58:29.679
you know what I'm saying?

993
00:58:29.880 --> 00:58:30.719
Something? Something?

994
00:58:30.840 --> 00:58:33.760
You know? And wow, thank you Carmen again for your

995
00:58:33.800 --> 00:58:37.679
hard work reading and writing all this, putting this together

996
00:58:38.280 --> 00:58:42.440
for us to learn. And a quick reminder that yeah,

997
00:58:42.440 --> 00:58:44.119
this is going to come out Thursday, so yeah, you

998
00:58:44.159 --> 00:58:46.559
can still catch just the number first twenty twenty five

999
00:58:46.599 --> 00:58:49.800
and in a spooky capacity in Yakima, Washington at our event,

1000
00:58:50.239 --> 00:58:52.119
the KUGUOI is going to get you where We're going

1001
00:58:52.199 --> 00:58:56.599
to tell some scary stories. And also you can support

1002
00:58:56.679 --> 00:59:00.480
us on Patreon. If you join, you get a weekly

1003
00:59:00.800 --> 00:59:03.840
so far as those have been weekly for sure, weekly

1004
00:59:03.880 --> 00:59:07.199
bonus episode where we just go through what's been happening.

1005
00:59:07.320 --> 00:59:10.320
Sometimes it's like fun internet discourse, but lately it's been

1006
00:59:10.480 --> 00:59:15.880
just depressing news story. After you will have to we're yelling, streaming, crying, throwing.

1007
00:59:15.719 --> 00:59:16.280
Up about it.

1008
00:59:16.480 --> 00:59:21.960
So yeah, so yeah, and other than that, we hope

1009
00:59:22.000 --> 00:59:24.159
that this is one less Ordia known for you.

1010
00:59:24.760 --> 00:59:26.039
Bye bye.

1011
00:59:28.559 --> 00:59:31.880
Estorias Are Known. Is produced by Carmen and Christina, researched

1012
00:59:31.880 --> 00:59:34.920
by Carmen and Christina, edited by Christina. You can find

1013
00:59:34.960 --> 00:59:38.079
sources for every episode at unknown dot com and in

1014
00:59:38.119 --> 00:59:40.679
our show notes creating the podcast has a lot of work,

1015
00:59:40.760 --> 00:59:42.679
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1016
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1017
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